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Tottenham Hotspur vs. Liverpool.

Tottenham's second serious pre season outing is highly interesting on several levels.

Two clubs that have removed experienced and arguably out-dated managers, for hoped for bright, technically astute 'Coach/Managers' who despite having career early success, will both be seen as gambles by many, and will probably both consider themselves to have plenty of work to do to build a team and playing ethos to complement their own ideas.

Two teams from the same country and league are always interesting tactical encounters, partly because they know each other so well, but are also desperate not to lose, as much as they want to win. A heavy defeat for either tonight will put instant pressure of the coming season regardless of how strong the teams actually are on the day.

Perhaps though this is more from the fans and media, and from a coaches perspective, playing a weaker side or a team that offers plenty of changes, at least makes any result appear to be all about preparation and fitness as opposed to mind games for the start of what I expect to be strong seasons for both.

Tonights staring line ups: Tottenham: Friedel; Naughton, Gallas, Kaboul, Assou-Ekotto; Jenas, Livermore; Lennon, Sigurdsson, Bale; Kane Liverpool: Jones, Enrique, Flanagan, Skrtel, Carragher, Spearing, Shelvey, Adam, Downing, Cole, Morgan.




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The journalist

Writer: OxfordSpur Mail feedback, articles or suggestions

Date:Saturday July 28 2012

Time: 6:57PM

Your Comments

Well, Well Well!
jvd
Anybody have a stream yet for the game?
jvd
http://www.thefirstrow.eu/watch/132591/1/watch-liverpool-fc-vs-tottenham-hotspur.html
luffy#9
http://www.atdhenet.tv/48577/watch-tottenham-vs-liverpool
Critical_Spur
Lennon hit the post! Cmon Azza, we know you can do it!
noone
What is with Charlie Adams?....determined to take out Bale.
Critical_Spur
Well, that was one boring first half of football. We started and finished the first half good, but in between Liverpool was slightly better. Bale had two good crosses and Lennon should have scored. I concur with KOSOVO_SPURS that Jenas is not good enough. Liverpool's high pressure made us pass the ball backwards. We seemed to lack the courage to make riskier passes. Charlie focking Adam tried to destroy Bale and he seems to have some problems with his angle now. Maybe he should be substituted off.
Jables
The games on ESPN, pretty boring and whats with the long ball tactics we look more like the spurs of the oneday ramos era
spurs4lyfe
Just found out I have got the time wrong. thought it kicked off at 8pm... Lucky the first half was *****e :-)
oxfordspur
Well miffed with Briedel constantly hoofing up field with no target man. Everytime straight to the opponents. At least Pool are playing like Swansea....simple ball from their goalie and 3 passes later they over halfway line and still have possession. Still the lads playing well and some good chances for both sides. Should be few changes for the 2nd half.
Critical_Spur
Out of interest guys, why did your board extend Jenas' contract?
CalculatedKalou
Under Ramos we won every friendly ,including a nice 5-0 thrashing of Roma .So reading too much into these games is not a good idea ,just enjoy them for what they are .
Jenas still in a Spurs shirt ? jeez wil he ever go away ?.

A New goalkeeper ,a right winger & 2 strikers a definite must .Modric set to seal 33 million transfer to madrid so a replacement for him a necessity .No cheap $hit ,has to as close to the talent of Modric as possible .
big cockeral
And that sweaty sock is a tw*t .
big cockeral
Big C. If i follow your analogy does that mean if we loose the rest of our pre season games. Will we them blitz the EPL haha heres to wishful thinking
spurs4lyfe
He did the same to bale last season. The guy should not be on the field.
vicspur
Townsend looks class! He will grow up to be new Lennon for us.
Jables
Big C - use Modders cash on the forward line. There is no replacement for Modric, he is unique. We can make do with Bale, Hudd, sandro, Parker, Lennon, sigurdsson in midfield.
TonyRich
Hudd changed the game. He can pass and I hope he stays fit this season. He makes Jenas look like a division 3 player. COYS
kosovo_spurs
Who needs Modric when we have Hudd! What a pass to our new CF Gallas!
Jables
TonyRich .Without the Modric money we should have cash to spend anyway .We`ve been selling for fun & haven`t really spent in the last 2 years .We shouldn`t be looking to go cheap on anyone now .
Quality over quantity but that comes at a price .If we`re not willing to spend it then we deserve to fail .If we don`t break our transfer fee record this summer then i`ll want to know why .Speculate to accumulate & i still believe with a few decent signings we can do Chelsea & Arsenal this year ,but not if we sit around watching everyone else & lose focus on ourselves .
big cockeral
Carroll coming on, I have great hope with this kid
ItalianYiddo
At last some pace of play in the side all down to Thudd and his ability to move the ball at speed under control. At the end of the first half Bale created stuff but since then we have had no creativity, no midfield. I am afraid this is the shape of things to come with no Modric
Forever Spurs
Big C, I think Siggy was the Modric replacement and I think most of us are kind of hoping for something better than that. We gave him a 60k a week which is higher than Modric currently. I think we are just waiting out for the best offer now. Also, I know its just a friendly and it may not mean all that much but its obvious in all the areas that we are weak in and that is creativity. Huddlestone can come in and do it vs weak teams but once teams close him down he is not going to be much of a threat. Realistically this is a side who is fighting for 5th and possibly could finish even lower than that. You can't assume that we don't have vdv, walker, ect because once the season starts there will be injures and other things that keep players out of games. I am really worried about this team taking major strides backward but its hard to say until the transfer window shuts and the season is over. Last season not selling Modric showed intent but now not spending money on quality and him still wanting out isnt really making me thrilled. Keep him or not it will not mean we see him at his best ever again.I just honestly want to part ways and hope to get a GK, CF, and maybe loan or Sahin wouldn't be terrible while we find a quality replacement.
RagingSpur
COYS lets get this transfer period started.
RagingSpur
Why on earth did Harry Kane take that free kick? I would have picked Vert from those on the pitch left.
Jables
We found Modric, Berbatov, Bale, VDV, Lennon, Carrick, BAE, Walker, Kaboul for a combined figure of around 40 million. Unfortunately our scouting system semms to have now broken down.
ItalianYiddo
seams
ItalianYiddo
That was a waste of 90 minutes. It is preseason I'll take away as much as needs to be taken away from that but there does need to be some major changes before the 1st game of the season because I didn't see to many players who can get us where we want to be.
RagingSpur
Can't draw any conclusions from that, but observations certainly. For me, Livermore is too much of a poser and holds us back, Jenas is still Jenas (sideways, sideways, backwards), Sigi was better than I thought but not great, and Tom Carroll must play ahead of Livermore, Jenas etc. Bentley is still the same waste of money that he always was (so far in his recovery), Gallas looked good, Naughton disappointing. No sign for me of how we might implement a high-line and overall nothing to stand out really. Obviously, I hope that Sandro, Ade and 2 others will make a significant difference but cannot judge anything at present.
Harry-Kari
Bassong & Bentley so poor. No determination, no focus & no ability. Carroll getting better & better. He has beefed up a bit fro his last season Europa games and he seems to win the ball well. With him in squad, I dont see the necessity of Joe Allen.
We controlled the game pretty much against almost first XI of Liverpool even without likes of Sandro, Parker, Modric, VDV, Adebayor. I guess at the moment hopig for 2 forwards to be signed along with an experienced CM.
sydqcb5
We definately need a creative midfielder. Hudd came on and gave us a different dimension with his passing, but he can't turn and manouver like Modric. Townsend looks just about decent enough for the EPL. I think that we may see Jenas feature for us this season, though I certainly hope that we don't see him in the first team.
Fanman
Big c - well true. I have always maintained that we have pots of cash to spend... But it was just a phase to say that replacing Modric is not the priority.
TonyRich
i'm all for abit of Jenas bashing now and then but i think it would be harsh to be critical of him today as he was playing in the Defensive midfield role and it is not like we conceded and he did win the ball back quite alot.
rated25thfc
AVB should be starting Carroll and not Jenas.
Fanman
Dont know what the fuss is about. We played with only 3 of our last season regulars for 45min and most of the game was played by our deadwoods & young prospects and we were better than Liverpool who almost had the first XI on park exception of Suarez. And fact is we weremuch better. Is this enough ? Iguess not. But looking at the players whoc are not available at the moment, I have to say this is decent performance in a 35 C temperature insecond preseason friendly
sydqcb5
AVB should be starting Carroll and not Jenas.
Fanman
This was the first game I saw under AVB and if I should jugde our tactics and players from just one game this would be my verdict. First the NEGATIVES: our defence high line looks like a major disaster! I hope AVB will change it. He should go for the same tactics we had last season with some tweaks of his own. Attacking wise a worrying fact against Liverpool was that we had zero chances to score after Bale left the pitch. A few transfer mr. Levy, please! Jenas is no good, sell him. Bentley should be sold if anyone is stupid enough to buy him. Kane is not ready for this level, loan him. Then the POSITIVES: Naughton looks like he can fill in for Walker and BAE. He started as a right back and moved to the left when BAE was substituted off. Townsend definitely has some promise in him! He could be our future new Lennon. Huddlestone can pass! Our midfield was much better when Hudd came in. Verts looks class even though he had only 15 minutes of playtime. I saw too little of Carroll to say anything of him.
Jables
Raging, by all accounts, Pienaar is done. Ade will be done within the next week. There is absolutely nothing about him going anywhere else. He wants to come. Spurs want him. The fee has been agreed. City just have to pay him to go. Otherwise he stays on their payroll til January at a cost of a further 3.5M and he walks. I do believe we're after Joe Allen.

Third preseason game. Sigurdsson has looked good in all three. Our backside pressure is much better than last season. The pitch today was very slow and with humidity the temperature was about 100, so you can't expect tons. Kane is not yet ready for prime time and that's our preseason striker. Swap him out for Adebayor and it's a huge step up. No VDV, Parker or Sandro. That's a huge drop in quality in the middle that will all be in the squad. Jenas, as ever, when playing deep, is useless. Bentley walking around looks like he couldn't give a toss. I expect neither to be in the starting 25. Townsend has still not figured out that you just can't try to nutmeg every player. Bale was ok, but the talent is there. Same for Lennon and Sigurdsson. Naughton, Walker, Kaboul, BAE, Vertonghen all look solid. I'm not that worried. We need a couple of strikers (I would argue three as I fail to see how Defoe will ever work in a ball-moving system), a Modric replacement, a wide player of top class (Remy - two birds one stone) and a keeper. Friedel still stays too deep for me and stops any counter-attack. Still three weeks. I expect most to be done after Spurs leave the US. Bentley/Jenas/Townsend/Kane/Bassong will all get one more chance. I expect all 5, along with Gio to be off permanently, or on loan. Livermore will be around until Parker is back. My 2 cents. COYS
peterballb
Conclusions JJ as to go he s not good enough - when he came off at 80min I didn't realise he was still on the pitch - average going to be any use

Bentley - as to go did nothing to show ushe is good enough.

Kane tried his best but just didn't seem much of a threat isn't ready for a top four side - we need at least 2 strikers.
Gif showe some good composure but he will not do Modric job not sure where he wil fit into the first 11.

Livermore average he will be behind th other cm's under AVB.

Townsend showed some good runs but not convinced he s good enough yet.

Bassong - times up of he needs to go.

Positives- Hudd looked good. Dawson was good doing what he does best. Young Carroll is the lad I believe is gifted and good enough now to join our first team squad.

We didn't seem to have a style and players didn't seem to blend and we didn't tick like we do with Modric - if we don't replace Modric and use what we have then we need something special up front better than Ade to get us the goals because we will not have so much possession without Modric so we need to compensate up front by being to rely on a striker that will get us out of trouble and one that will scare the opposition.

WE look like WIP (work n progress) and lacked that 'special' quality - don't kid yourself Modric is a class above these players.
thfan
RagingSpur, I agree and disagree...the players were there mostly, just not playing at the same time. For one thing I think it shows if we're gonna play a 4-2-3-1 one of the back 2 midfield needs to have a decent range of passing to link the play. Thudd showed he can do a decent job at doing that but if Sahin is available to loan as part of the Modric deal he'd be even more ideal. Even though neither were playing I think we'd struggle to keep possession with Sandro and Parker together there making the high line massively exposed. Townsend looks like he's ready to deputise on the wings when needed which is a definite positive. It's a shame Kane isn't ready to step up though. Still has time on his side but I've seen nothing so far to suggest he has the instinct or skill to be in the right place at the right time to be a good striker, and in tonights game that obviously had a big impact on how the players behind him were able to perform.
flipper
rated25thfc, I didn't notice Jenas winning the ball back, but I do remember Skertel running straight through our midfield. I think that Jenas will be good for the cup competitions and the europa league, but do you want to see him in the EPL starting XI?
Fanman
sorry for the bold
thfan
Ive sorted it now lol
thfan
sydqcb5, pre season is supposed to be for the 1st team, to get them prepared for the start of the season. Its always a concern when its being wasted on deadwood and prospects.
Guyver
NOTICE TO ALL OF YOU ----WARNING ---WARNING--- I lost connection to the game due to some ba$tard scammers locking up my computer, Ref comes in the shape of UKash Met Police logo, it's back doing the rounds, go to google type in ''scammers locking up computers'' I'm not IT wiz, but i got (as you can see) it working again, by going into safe mode networking, pressing F8 when your computer, shows the first sign of coming on, then set new system restore point, my computer is scanning as we speak or in this case type, SO PLEASE DON'T PANIC, JUST BE AWARE IT'S A PHUCKING SCAM, which was with us last year. And i take it, it was 0-0 can't see any mention of goals...
spu 4 life
Guyver, its not wasted.Deadwoods are being played out of necessity when you have International competitions like Olympics & Euros ahead of preseason friendlies!
sydqcb5
Thanks spu 4 life
thfan
JENAS will be excellent in cup games, YEAH FOR SOMEBODY ELSE, we know his shi7, AVB is yet to find that part out.
spu 4 life
So its wasted then sydqcb5, even if the reasons are valid, its still a semi wasted pre season. Scary thing is, the only major player I can think of effected by international comp is Sandro. What we are seeing out there is currently 100% Spurs minus Sandro.
Guyver
I keep condoms and a BASEBALL BAT next to my bed, the police told me it's a dangerous weapon, i said ''I know'' but what about the baseball bat?
spu 4 life
syd, exactly. AVB is letting Jenas, Bassong, Bentley and others determine if they have what it takes. I believe, subject to parties coming in who are obvious upgrades (ie Lloris or Cesar), our squad will be: Cudicini, Friedel, Gomes, Walker, Naughton, Caulker, Kaboul, Dawson, Gallas, Vertonghen, BAE, Fryers, Hudd, Parker, Sandro, Bale, Rose, Lennon, Sigurdsson, VDV, Defoe. Everyone else is vying for the remaining 5 or six spots. Any quality additions will merely fill those spaces. Short of a sign of life, Bassong and Jenas will be sold. Bentley will likely be a subsidized loan. The first task for AVB is to pare the squad down. I'd rather keep Carroll, Townsend and Smith than watch Jenas, Bentley and Bassong. If I'm honest, I am very disappointed in Bassong. I really thought he'd come good. To be fair, he's neither a LB or a LW, but Rose has done way better playing out of position. COYS
peterballb
Peter, I still can't see any future what so ever for Bassong, Jenas, Bentley and Gio at Spurs, I can't think of any reason to keep them; and reading over your squad makes even more sense, but your right, as others are, he has to make his own judgement. We really need to get that cheque book working again and very soon. Will this Modric saga get put to bed? Pienaar looks almost set for everton, this surely paves the way for Ade?
spu 4 life
Guyver, they are just working on conditioning. We haven't yet seen even an approximate starting XI. I'd love to see our MF with Sandro in front of the back 4 with Sigurdsson and VDV on top of them, Bale and Lennon out wide and Adebayor up top. Sandro is a beast. 2 ball moving players to launch the attack. pace out wide and a striker who can play football, use his head and who can create. I think we are much better looking than some are giving credit. Guys aren't yet fit, it's brutally hot and fringe players are getting their last chances. I really don't see it as a waste of time. I'm sure August 9, we'll see the starting XI AVB intends to start against Newcastle. If Jenas, Bentley, Bassong, Pienaar and Modric are all gone, Ade and another striker signed and another winger in, I'll be very happy with this window. If that winger is Remy, I'd be ecstatic. If Moutinho or Allen are in to replace Modric, even happier. It's neither Bleak House, nor Hard Times. Great Expectations perhaps and we'll pip them all in to the CL. COYS
peterballb
This is a Spurs team which has average written all it.
MrSpurs
I want to see Hudd playing with main XIstarters. He is playing with likes of Bentley Jenas, Livermore & Bassong and there is no way we can see how good is afterinjury come back.Hopefully he starts against Redbullls part of our strongest preseason XI.
sydqcb5
We need a play maker, someone who has the techincal ability to hold the ball like Modric who can make the killer pass but alos relieve the pressure om the defense by keeping the ball.
MrSpurs
Spu 4, the fact is there has been a lot of damage with players being frozen out of this team. I think, AVB's approach is a bit of damage control which conveniently fits in with the Euros and the Olympics. Fact is, VDV and a few others are not ready to be putting in 90 minutes and we have squad players at the Olympics. Perfect scenario to allow assets to prove themselves or to be realized. I don't believe as Bassong was ever in AVB's plans. Why sign Vertonghen otherwise? Same goes for Bentley and Gio. Why sign Sigurdsson? Pienaar, I believe could have been a great asset in this system but I believe his mind was made up. Same for Modric. Levy knows all this as does AVB. For the first time in 4 years, I believe there is a concrete plan. I believe the squad will be pared down and I believe players like Caulker, Naughton, Vertonghen, Fryers, Sigurdsson are replacing what we all call dead wood, all of which will finally be moved out. The free picks, Carroll, Fryers and others will see action, but we'll have a squad of 25 that AVB intends to use. I am absolutely optimistic about the future of Spurs. There will be bumps. There will be guys that don't get it. I believe AVB will move them on and will put together a squad that can play a style of football we'll all love. Bale, Lennon, VDV, Sigurdsson, Ade can all score goals and create. There's my front five. Supplement them with players like Remy and Perisic and it's awesome. Add a clinical striker with strength and pace (Rossi) and it could be the beginning of something awesome. Our defence is much more competent and mobile than what Chelsea had/have. We'll be just fine. COYS
peterballb
Hudd is too slow & can`t defend,he doesn`t tick enough boxes to be a top top player in his position . But he can pass ? not enough .
He`s similar to Alonso in passing but Alonso is far superior in every other way except hairstyles .
big cockeral
peterballb - "I am absolutely optimistic about the future of Spurs" Whilst your optimism is great it is completely unfounded.
MrSpurs
Mr. Spurs, I see nothing average in a starting XI comprised of Friedel/Gomes, Walker/Naughton, 2 of Kaboul, Caulker, Vertonghen, Gallas, Dawson, BAE/Naughton, Sandro/Parker, 4 of Hudd. Sigurdsson, Bale, Lennon, VDV, and Ade. True, no Modric, but I believe we are as good or better everywhere else with a few more players still to come in. Fourth last season. Chelsea's defence still sucks and Lampard and Terry are still older. Liverpool haven't added enough to make a difference, and Gerrard is still older. If Arsenal lose Van Perie, they are not better off. ManU? I don't think so. City can still only field eleven at a time. I really don't understand the negativity. Look at Liverpool's first 5 games. They could be 0-5. If we are healthy when we go in to Newcastle, I believe we have the players to go 5-0 to start. It'll be a tough game. I still believe we have the players to win it. Modric is a big loss. He is but one player who doesn't want to be here any more. We'll be fine. COYS
peterballb
big cockeral - spot on mate - Hudd is squad player - at best! there is actually more of an arguement that Jenas should be considered ahead of him.
MrSpurs
big c, well if he can be slow but pass like Pirlo from half line, he is good enough for me. Hudd needs minutes under his belt. Offseason - we got to give it to him he has lost weight; infact the first time I am seeing this light weight.
sydqcb5
Jenas better than Hudd. He's faster, I'll give you that. That's about all he's better at. Hudd and Modric played pretty good side by side as I recall to get us 4th. Hudd is plenty quick enough and the composure of today's game changed as soon as he came on. Night and day. COYS
peterballb
Total waste of time. Like holding a woodbine up in the Albert Hall.
tophobunty
peterballb - Its ironic that you use Chelsea as one of your examples as to where we are as it is our current manager that has given us hope that we can we overtake them by pratically taking them down single handed.
MrSpurs
Peterballb, I'd love to hear your opinion on our GK, though I'm quite sure where you stand i.e. Gomes over Friedel. Need for a new one, or can wait til next season? I would def have Gomes start this year, and next season Cudicini and Friedel shift out with two new prodeges shifting in.
tengboon
Mr. Spurs, where exactly have all of the other clubs around us improved? I don't see it. We have replaced an aging and ailing King with Vertonghen. One of the best young left-sided CB's in the game. He's not Ledley King at his prome, but then King hasn't been that for some time. Nelsen replaced by Caulker. Huge upgrade. Pienaar/Kranjcar/Bentley replaced by Sigurdsson. Again, huge upgrade as the lad can play. BAE is still one of the best LB's in the EPL. Bale is still the best LW in the world. Lennon is still one of the best RW in the EPL and Walker is one of the best RB's out there with cover on both sides by Naughton, a player I rate better than Walker. VDV is still a top footballer and Ade, assuming he signs, wants to be here and produced pretty decent numbers while squandering tons of chances. A few good additions, some tactics and execution on set pieces and who knows, maybe we'll win all those games we should have over the past four years but didn't because we could not break teams down. This is a very good young team. Add Remy, Lloris, Allen and Ba and we'll be pretty well off, IMO. COYS
peterballb
Why oh why did we not move for Hoillett on a free?? AVB must not rate him, let's see if he's a regular starter at QPR
tengboon
sydqcb5 - Hudd compared to Pirlo is not great comparison because of the speed and pressure of the Premier League compared to the Euros. Pirlo would not make such a impact in the PL - he would not be given the time.
MrSpurs
Pretty shocking that a third of us think Kaboul as our captain. My vote was for Vertongen, leaving Parker out due to injury, which I reckon will be the case all year
tengboon
All very well saying Modric is only one player but he's worth four of the others. He made spurs tick and he's absence was clearly visible in these pre season games. He is irreplaceable.
Hot_Spur
tengboon, I am not a fan of Friedel at all. He never gets to aything difficult and, as was seen again today, never comes off his line. Yes, Gomes goes on adventures and one wonders what the heck he is doing but he sets a counter attack off like no other, he makes saves few can make, has gone the wrong way, by my count, on a penalty twice, and saves way more than most. Friedel has not saved a penalty in at least 3 years (could be more but the stats I can find only go back that far). We need a new keeper because Cudicini is nowhere near good enough. He's past it. None of our keepers are good enough for the system AVB wants to play. You really need a sweeper. Vorm, though small for my liking, may well be ideal. He is a good shot-stopper with excellent anticipation. Of the three we have, Gomes would be my starter. If we can get Lloris, that would be great. I'd still rather we stump the cash and buy Loach, sell Friedel, buy Butland, loan him back and then sell Gomes in January or next summer as he plans to go back to Brasil when his contract is up. Should have treated Pletikosa better. He is a very good keeper as he again showed in the Euros. Couple of top drawer saves. COYS
peterballb
peterballb - again I love your optimism but for all the names you mention (some of which are not even Spurs players) I have serious doubts over AVB tactics - do you not share my fear at seeing Dawson play a high line!!!!! - a AVB tactic which he loves but does not suit the PL.
MrSpurs
Apart from my Canadian bias, I would take Hoillett. He is better than I ever expect Townsend to be. That said, I'd still be after Affelay and Remy long before that. COYS
peterballb
Hot_Spur - exactly mate Modric is an unloyal rat but he is by far our best midfield player and his ability to retain the ball and relieve pressure is worth so much. Put it this way if we had two Modric's in midfield we would be formidable. Only his goal tally lets him down.
MrSpurs
You can't judge a keeper on the number of penalties he saves or doesn't save. No keeper should EVER save a penalty if it's taken properly. If the keeper saves it's a badly taken penalty.
Hot_Spur
MrSpurs, Dawson, as I see things, is behind Kaboul, Gallas and even Caulker so I don't really worry too much. Gallas/Dawson in a cup game with Kaboul/Vertonghen in the league game with Caulker as backup really doesn't have me worrying. In fact, while Dawson was on against LA, he looked pretty good and composed, but he's nowhere near first choice. That's like asking me if I'm not concerned that Cudicini is our keeper. Not worried because he's very unlikely to play much more than a bit role. Take our best XI and if you think they are not in the top 4, then we see things very differently. No we don't have Ade yet. Wait until next week. Then we will. COYS
peterballb
peterballb - "where exactly have all of the other clubs around us improved?" You assume that you have to buy players to improve - IMO Arsenal have not improved for years but they chose a manager and stuck by him through thick and thin, good and bad, their reward may not be trophies but they have finished top 4 every year - we just jump from one crisis to another!
MrSpurs
Fine Hot_Spur, then Gomes is fabulously lucky. Lucky is better than always unlucky. Went the wrong way twice. That gets in players heads and that makes players try to be too fine. Ask England players. They know all about it. COYS
peterballb
peterballb - yeah I take the point my mistake was to use Dawson as an example when really the point im trying to make is that AVB uses tactics regardless of personel. We will play a high line Im sure I just hope our players can cope with it.
MrSpurs
peterballb, I wish I shared your optimism, but unless we sign cover for the wide areas, a good replacement for Modric and some good forwards, we won't be playing CL football in 13/14. 1 thing seems certain, we won't be prepared for the start of this season, especially as we are adjusting to a new system with crap like Jenas and Bentley rather than our potential new signings.
Guyver
Mr Spurs, I see what you're saying about the Arse, no matter which big player they seem to lose, they still have the mentality to win games they have no right winning. Same will be when RVP goes, they are simply a top 4 team as long as Wenger runs it. I have big question marks about Chelsea, they've made some big name signings, but none that really fill the aging gaps they have. I think they'll get found out. Di Matteo's in for a rough ride.
tengboon
Peter, I don't think you are being fair. A keeper has to decide to go one way or other and hope. He can't wait to see which corner it's going coz he will never get to it if it's going with pace as it should be. If he goes the wrong way it's too bad, ALL keepers go the wrong way sometimes - it's pot luck.
Hot_Spur
Gomes is a liability - great character - great shot stopper - great bloke im sure - but all of that means nothing when Chelsea fans are crying with laughter becasue his dropped the ball between his legs in to the net!! once is once too many and players like Vert need confidence when joining a new club not the uncertainty of having that joker behind them.
MrSpurs
MrSpurs, I suppose that's because we throw our manager under the bus before a ball has been kicked in anger. It's clear you don't like AVB. That's fine. You could be right. What I know is that this same group of guys (less Modric) with no coaching or execution whatsoever, managed 4th twice and a 5th. Many of the same young guys played roles in two 5ths under Jol and a CC trophy under Ramos. This is where we are. We are not a mid-table team. There are 7 teams that can seriously suggest that they could get a top 4 position without breaking into laughter. We are one of them. What have we lost? Ade (as things stand), Pienaar, Modric, Nelsen, Saha, Kranjcar, Corluka, King. What have we gained? Vertonghen, Sigurdsson, Fryers, Caulker, Naughton. Other than Modric who wants out, we are, IMO, better off across the board, now and for the next 3-7 years. Add a winger or 2 a striker or 2 and a keeper or 2 and we'll compete week in and week out in all 4 competitions. COYS
peterballb
We've had this Gomes debate a million times on here. De Gea had way more fowlers last year then Gomes had in his entire 3 seasons at Spurs. You don't see Sir Alex spitting the dummy and throwing his toys out the pram, as much as Reds fans did. Considering the centre backs we have lined up to start this season, Gomes would shine if given a go.
tengboon
Hot_Spur, some keepers read it better than others. All go the wrong way on occasion. Friedel doesn't save any. He doesn't get in to anyone's head. Cech, Buffon, Gomes, Reina do. It makes a difference and a penalty save often turns a game on its head. Keepers react to what a shooter is doing. You can Pirlo it and few will save it (ok, perhaps Grobelaar), but most players you can read where they are going. Advantage is always with the shooter. Some keepers have better numbers than others. It's not just dumb luck. Some are better, some are worse. COYS
peterballb
peterballb - Your making assumptions there. I hope that AVB is a success and I will back him like any other manager after all I'm Tottenham through and through but my concerns are simple aka what happend at Chelsea. I dont want to get into a "yeah but at Chelsea this happened and that happened...." at the end of the day we critised Harry for being tactically inept (and at times rightly so) but IMO we have replaced him with some one who has the same faults. Time will tell.
MrSpurs
Also Peter, Harry ultimately failed twice because he didnt use the "squad" this isnt just about the 1st XI. With decent back up players like Pienaar and Kranc no longer with us, the only difference between Harry and AVB could be that Harry chose not to use the squad, whereas AVB won't have much of a squad to choose from. But we will see.
Guyver
This as I read that Inter's Julio Cesar is deciding between which North London team he'd prefer. I'd prefer to sign Butland and rid of either Cudicini or Friedel. Age before beauty in this case.
tengboon
Guyver, it's still three weeks before the season starts. I believe Ade will sign. I believe we will replace Modric (Levy has already said he will go nowhere unless we have our replacement - the deal is already more or less done). I believe we will add the 3rd striker AVB has said we need and I believe once Jenas, Bassong, Gio, Bentley decisions are made and it's determined that Townsend and the other kids aren't quite there, wing cover will be added. There is a plan. AVB was the plan before Harry was let go. Vertonghen, Sigurdsson and others knew who the manager was going to be. If nothing is done prior to the Newcastle game, I'll be with you. If Pienaar and Modric are gone this week, Ade in and others on the way in, I'll be quite happy. COYS
peterballb
tengboon - Gomes makes too many mistakes and to think I let him shag my wife!!!
MrSpurs
As far as I know, Tim Sherwood is still running our development program. Falque. Smith. Coulibaly. Kane. Etc., plenty of squad to choose from. Other than strikers, every position on our first team is covered with decent quality, the only question mark perhaps with Lennon, but Siggs can play on the right and score, he did so for Swansea last season.
tengboon
peterballb - Im not so sure AVB was first choice.
MrSpurs
I only hope we sign Ade as he is the best option .I can see trouble ahead with this man ,but beggars can`t be choosers .
He`s clearly an half decent player when he wants to be ,but that chip on his shoulder never seems to want to go away .Giving him a 4 year deal could be a massive mistake imo ,but it does appear our options are limited .
Harrys a dick leaving a squad in this mess .There`s holes everywhere ,glad he`s gone .
big cockeral
MrSpurs, dear sir, leave your wife out of this, how could you!!! ;)
tengboon
tengboon - "Falque. Smith. Coulibaly. Kane. Etc" can you see any of those player becoming must pick first teamers?............ no neither can I.
MrSpurs
Big C, that's too easy, Harry did not leave this squad in a mess, simply because he was working for Levy and Spurs board would not allow him to mess it up. It was always a stop-gap measure since he took over, and he achieved what he was capable of. We can do better, and `I think we will. We're not bloody Portsmouth or West Ham.
tengboon
big cockeral - so Harry did well to finish 4th with a squad that is a "mess".
MrSpurs
... lets not forget AVB finished 6th with a squad that won the CL!!
MrSpurs
LOL, media now saying AVB is after Fulham's Dembele to fill Modric's place, they have no idea do they, pure guesswork.
Hot_Spur
Guyver, we have Cudicini, Gomes, Friedel, Walker, Naughton, Smith, Caulker, Dawson, Gallas, Kaboul, Vertonghen, BAE, Fryers, Parker, Hudd, Sandro, Livermore, Bale, Lennon, Sigurdsson, Carroll, VDV, Defoe, Kane, Rose. There's 25 players in a squad. Great? No. Good? Yes. Add Abebayor and another striker, a winger/striker like Remy, Affelay, a keeper like Lloris or Loach and we are a better team, all around, than last season. Depending on the Modric replacement, we could well be a well oiled machine with a squad of players that will all play a part and all want to be there. The reason we qualified for CL the first time around was that our squad made the difference. City had a better starting XI. We had a better team. AVB, IMO, is miles better than Redknapp. That's what remains to be seen. That's where the paranoia stems from. Let's let it play out. The players are still good enough to compete. Converting free kicks and corners would have seen us third last year. Just 1 would have been enough. I will not start tearing AVB down until he has had a chance to mould this team the way he wants. We are better than Chelsea and our back four are far more athletic than what Chelsea had. I give him the benefit of the doubt. He did win the treble. No matter what league you do that in, it's an accomplishment. He also managed, with such a poor system, to keep Chelsea in the Cups that they eventually won and did every bit as well as DiMatteo in the League. He'll be fine. So will Spurs. The future is bright, the future is LillyWhite. COYS
peterballb
MrSpurs
Harry had 4 strikers ,he left us with one .
Signed a goalkeeper who was good for one year .
All our ageing players are one year older & closer to being spent .
King has retired .
Deadwood everywhere
Everything under Harry was so temporary
big cockeral
What I'm hearing is that Defensively we are more or less sorted (Lloris in) Noughton gives us much needed cover at RB/LB Smith out on loan. Townsend in the squad or prem loan move (nearly there), likewise Carrol, Kane needs more game time and a bit toughening up (send him North to Scotland). Jenas, bassong and bentley are been given enough rope to hang themselves and also allowing for more rest of our first team on extensive pre-season. Big hole in the attacking midfield department with modders gone (I would have liked to have seen pienaar there before he was sent back to Everton). We Certainly need a signing there to plug the hole. Ade in, still needs at least one more striker to offer competition/options for the team. In summary then GK, CAM and striker (assuming ade) a must have. Optional winger if the money is right. Bentley, Jenas, Bassong, Gio, Gomes/Brad, cudicini all surplus.
Slurms McKenzie
Scott Parker is another .He looks like he`s been on the pi$$ all night & slept on a park bench .I don`t expect much from him next season
big cockeral
peterballb - I am a Harry fan so immediately I have got people's back up on this one but hear me out.......... Harry got us in top 4 in his first full season. There was no BS about a "project" no pretence or showmanship he just got on with it and delivered. Why should we wait for AVB to do the same? P.S. Harry *****ed me off as much as any one in the end but he has raised the bar for our great club and if AVB cant match that then questions need to be raised.
MrSpurs
big cockeral - yeah but Comoli was looking at the future when he signed the likes of Bentely - football is about the now its about this season - dont be fooled with the latest fashion of talking about 'projects' and 'master plans'. Parker done a job, friedel done a job and ironically if Chelsea had stuck with the manager that we now have we would have made the Champions League.
MrSpurs
MrSpurs Yes but didn`t Harry spend his whole 4 years living off Commoli signings ?
IMO Harry was poor in the transfer market .Commoli got a couple of big ones wrong ,but his signings got us to this level (just my opinion )
big cockeral
MrSpurs, Harry's side threw away 21 points in the season he got top 4 in games where we dominated. Harry was all about showmanship. Harry was all about throwing players under the bus. It was by luck, nothing else, that injuries forced his hand and allowed players to come in where otherwise they would have remained firmly nailed to the bench. Harry is a hack as a football manager. Great quotes though, if that's your thing. Also never accountable. I have never liked Harry Redknapp and would never have hired him, let alone fired Ramos (whose system Harry adopted after a year once he got VDV). Yet I gave Harry one full year before I let in to him on any subject. It was not until December 2009 that I started in on him. Go have a run about is not coaching. It's allowing the players to do what they want. They did. They got 4th, 5th, 5th. Jol got 5th twice with a fraction of the talent and a much stronger top 4. Harry has won one trophy in his entire coaching career considering competitions to be below him. Well, we now have a manager who has a style, has a plan and has won more in a couple of seasons than Harry has in his whole career. Ramos won more with Spurs than Harry did. Why? Because he could coach and he set our team up to beat the opposition. Sure, repeat Harry's mantra, 2 points in 8, but it doesn't tell the story that we had no replacement at striker, new players front to back, and still remained in Europa and the CC. Rightly so, teams are beating down his door to come coach them. He'll be hired in December by a team in danger of relegation and he'll play his best XI in to the ground, spend ridiculous sums of money on older players and allow the team to eventually be relegated a couple of years later in a huge financial mess. Won't be his fault. Never has been. Always someone else to blame. COYS
peterballb
MrSpurs
I also agree about this project thing and people saying " in 3 years time ......" heard it all before & it gets so blah blah blah .
But i also think Harry was too far the other way .Did everything for today ,but no care for "in 3 years time ....." you have to balance the 2 .
I think we need at least 5 players & to get rid of at least 5 .I think under Harry we came full circle & Levy acted for damage limitation ,saw the signs & acted ,they weren`t hard to spot .
Harry was stockpiling players ,you can only get away with that for so long .
big cockeral
One away league win in 2012 & an FA Cup thrashing says it all .
It was all falling apart around him
big cockeral
MrSpurs, in general you are right that football is about "now" and not projects. HOWEVER, that is because club owners are too impatient, it's not necessarily the best policy in the long/medium term. Look at Fergie at ManU, he didn't do very well at first but look at the rewards eventually !! Because his bosses realized that a manager need TIME to do the business.
Hot_Spur
I think too many people on VS get excited by having a continental coach. Results show that Ramos failed and that AVB (lets put it politely) struggled at Chelsea. Harry for all his failings did deliver a 4th, 5th, 4th + we got to see some great nights at WHL in the CL. I hated the way he conducted his interviews and I disagreed with his tactics at times but he did deliver. Whether Harry owes it all to Comoli, Levy, or the ******** tooth fairy who gives a ***** the man delivered. AVB needs to do the same.
MrSpurs
Just an observation and not an attack on anyone. It seems to me that there are many on here who are not giving AVB even the right to make a mistake before calling him out on the carpet. What Spurs need are results on the pitch. If we finish below 7th, the year is an utter failure. I don't think these players, if healthy, are capable of that. A high defensive line is nothing new. Old school really. Italians have been doing it for decades. Compress the field. Move forward and back as a group. I saw it in today's game. As they were looking after Bale, AVB pulled Kaboul aside and spoke to him. from that point on, but for one time in the second half, we didn't get caught out. The defenders started anticipating passes and picked them off. As it went on we became more comfortable. Same for the game against LA. We have a very young, fit, athletic back 4. Chelsea did not. We will also have Parker or Sandro sitting in front of them. Really, it's not that bad. If we'd have been focused for the first 10-15 minutes of games last season, we'd have gotten 10-15 more points. This young team just needs to be coached. They haven't had that for 4 years. IMO, that is changing. All I ask is that he be given a chance. With this great squad, Harry won nothing. Let's see what AVB can do. COYS
peterballb
I agree with the squad being left in a "mess" situation. The recruitment of old fogies was a shortsighted consideration and lack of rotation added to the mess. Basically, its now up to AVB to sort of the mess, i.e, finally dispense with te deadwoods and to find a core of players (along with the new recruits) to move us forward. And at the pace that we are moving in the transfer market, I am with Guyver, i.e., "we won't be prepared for the start of this season, especially as we are adjusting to a new system with crap like Jenas and Bentley rather than our potential new signings."

AVB has his work cut out with new system, a mixture of players that won't have enough competitive practice time together. I honestly hope that these USA friendlies represent the FINAL games for some the dead woods and that once back home, the final frindlies run-in would include our FINAL 25 to start the reason. Olympics out of the way, No 14 departed new recruits in place and the start of the new era. COYS.
Critical_Spur
big cockeral - The thing is I dont think we would have been thrashed by Chelsea in the FA Cup if AVB was still in charge of them. Anyway this is all in the past lets look forward - good luck AVB.
MrSpurs
Just consider the training schedule as well, under Harry they did one 2-3 hour session per day and all they did was jog round a field, no ball training. With AVB they are doing three 2.5 hour sessions per day and three quarters of it is with a ball. Problem with Harry was that the players were not fit due to lack of training, that's why the performances collapsed at the end.
Hot_Spur
MrSpurs The best managers are the continental ones .
Ramos is a name left in infamy & has scarred some for life .Apart from Ferguson all the British managers fall short .
For me coming 4th isn`t all that anyway ,didn`t Everton under Moyes come 4th ?

Under Harry we won nothing .What do you get in the olympics for coming 4th ? At least Ramos won a cup beating Ar5ena1 & then Chelsea on the way .Under Harry we were still falling way short even though others were clearly below their usual standards .Poor management enabled Arsenal to beat us to 3rd ,so NO he did not always deliver .We needed 3rd & it was on a plate .If only Harry thought about the club as much as himself ......
big cockeral
I think the paranoia might stem from the belief that this season feels eerily like the 08/09 season. Latin coach, with a continental style of play. Ex Spurs player as his assistant (Poyet). Star player wants out, no strikers, need a new GK..
Guyver
peterballb - I think that it was probably the right thing to sack Harry in the end and in AVB we will have a man who really cares and wants to suceed - something that Harry did not convey that much but if we are to critise Harry's results its only fair we use those critisms as a benchmark for AVB therefore I dont see why AVB should be given time as he has inherited a squad which finished 4th and should have finished 3rd.
MrSpurs
MrSpurs, one could also suggest that there is a huge bias on here against Continental coaches. Ramos was never given the benefit of the doubt. Jol was always looked at as being naive, even if a really nice guy. When you take in to consideration what each manager had at their disposal, Jol's accomplishments far exceed anything Harry ever did. There is nothing to suggest Harry would have beat Chelsea if AVB were still their manager in the FA Cup semi. He did manage to get Chelsea further in to the CL than any of the other EPL CL squads. Unfortunately, he had no support from the veterans and had an assistant more than happy to push him overboard. Karma is a coming. COYS
peterballb
big cockeral - yeah totally understand and agree about the trophy point but top players want CL football and you need top players to win trophies so its vicious circle.
MrSpurs
P.S. I am in no way an anti continental coach - if my posts gave that impression then I take it back.
MrSpurs
the slagging off of friedel here is unjustified, he's been great for us in his short time at the club and didn't do anything wrong today!
COYS_TSB
Trophies are important for confidence and psychological boost.....that 'feel good' thing!. Instead when we had 3rd handed to us on a plate, our mnager said we were over-achieving.....what hppened after that is history!
Critical_Spur
MrSpurs, my minimal expectation of Spurs since the last years of Jol has been European qualification by table position. It remains so under AVB. It's impossible to expect 3rd from AVB when we are losing arguably our best player. New manager, new CB in for King, dead wood hopefully gone, new striker in (hopefully), new keeper by next year at the latest. It's hard to expect 3rd with all that. Do we have the talent? Absolutely. But then we won't be throwing away two competitions this year, so it will be more of a burden on the squad. I believe our talent was good enough to challenge for the title the past 3 seasons. For parts we did. I still think that talent is there. Inter Milan were not, IMO, even in the top 5 teams in Europe when Mourinho took them to the treble. I didn't even think they were the best team in Italy. Just the best coached. I believe we have the ability, right now, to compete in all 4 competitions we are in. Anything less and I'l be disappointed. If we're in Europe next year, the season will not be a failure. If we're in the CL, it'll be a brilliant success. COYS
peterballb
Not sure you can say Continental managers are the best, there are good and bad in both Continental and English. The best manager spurs have ever had was English (Bill Nick). One of the best managers the world has ever seen was English. (Brian Clough). There have been many other good English managers.
Hot_Spur
COYS_TSB, Cudicini didn't do anything wrong against the Galaxy, but is clearly not good enough any longer. Friedel, down the stretch was average. He does not look to make mistakes because he doesn't go for anything. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. He only made a couple of saves all year long where I said, good save. Gomes did that every game in the year we finished 4th with Dawson and Bassong in front of him. Friedel is not good enough. We need better. He's also gone next year. Gomes in 2 years and Cudicini, IMO, is done. We need a keeper for the here and now. COYS
peterballb
Here's what I believe about managers, they are hired to get a specific group of players to perform beyond their abilities and they are fired for not doing so. It's why Inter can win a trophy a year on average while having a manager a year on average. RM are the same. Certain players are key. Managers come and go. Very few have a tenure such as Sir Alex, who won Europe in a 2nd class league before going to United. Let's hope we have found a diamond in the rough in AVB. I believe the potential and the pedigree is there. Time will tell. COYS
peterballb
Bentley annoys the crap out of me and doesn't seem to give a toss. Also, bale remains our one and only true match winner. Lennon needs to make that leap this year and I think sigh will equally become a match winner. We still need some in and out transfers ASAP.
Windlespur
Peter, I haven't been watching the preseason and I'm very satisfied not to, and to just let things take shape for the season. But your review of the progression is exactly what I would like to see. The matter of not being coached in this way before, i hope, has the players eager and willing to adopt the more conscious approach to controlling a game. I think it's assured that there will be a degree of failure, but aspects sound encouraging if your view is accurate.
ardone
Hot_Spur I was thinking more of football today .The last true great British manager was Bobby Robson imo ,brilliant manager & brilliant bloke ,respect .In the last 15 years British managers apart from Fergie , have won next to nothing .
I`m English & still wouldn`t have gone for an Englishman as manager ,& after Terry been found not guilty shouldn`t have sacked Cappello ,i liked Cappello & saknig him for Hodgson is madness .
The FA should throw the book at both Terry & Ferdinand & give them a slap for being complete bellends & tell them to give 100 grand to Great ormond street hospital .Rio is a tw*t aswell ,can`t stand that bloke .The attitude of players today ruins the game ,Ade ,Ballottelli ,Barton,Evra ,Suarez gets on my tits .Need to start giving season bans for these dicks .
big cockeral
Hate per-season either playing or watching, means nothing, totally uncompetitive and pointless. Only fitness and the fact by the first proper game things should be in shape and real football can begin. My only pre-season concern is ours won't finish until Aug 31st when we'll finally buy someone and sort our squad out. Need to get players in straight after USA return, next week there wants to be some good news,

Didn't watch the game, sounded rubbish but doesn't matter. One thing I do know is both AVB and Rodgers won't both turn out good, let's hope we've picked the winner.
T.H.F.Chris
I just finished watching the match. I couldn't glean anything from this match other than I still see players (Huddlestone, Jenas, Lennon, Bentley) who were not part of our success the past few years. When are we going to move on from these guys? Actually, Huddlestone made a few really good passes, but he's sooo slow..... We defended reasonably well against a mediocre Liverpool team (not their best XI either). I think we'll be ok defensively, but if we don't sign a striker, Defoe/Kane won't be enough to fulfill our ambitions.
NYSpursFan
How can you even compare Hudd and Pirlo? Euros or PL Pirlo would run circles around Huddlestone. Huddlestone is very overrated player but almost every Spurs fan and he is a joke of a footballer for me. I am sorry he can do his passing...yes but seriously he is nothing more than a mere squad player. With all do respect Hudd isn't going to fill the hole left by Modric...
RagingSpur
BigC, I think there are a lot of very good British managers at present. I think there was a period of imposters (harry-not trying to annoy, Allardyce and co) that really were just mouthpieces. The new generation, Coyle, Rogers, Lambert and others are all students of the game. They analyze, stress fundamentals, play percentages and are all very good. I know you will say, Peter, give up on the Coyle thing. They all have players who respect them and get what they are teaching. They are teachers and psychologists all at the same time. They are all about getting players to do what is necessary. Reverse psychology is fine with them, as is hard love. It's all about recognizing that Pav needs a different touch than Bale. Not saying Pav was a world beater, but I believe he had way more in the tank than he ever showed. That is a failing of Harry. He only cares about those he likes. DiCanio was a right proper lazy player, but Harry liked him, so he indulged him and on occasion, DiCanio showed up. He played regardless. I suspect everyone will play and everyone will sit under AVB. If Lennon does not perform as he should, he will sit, but it won't be to allow someone to play right wing who does not accomplish what is expected of a right winger just because the manager likes him. AVB is a coach. Harry is a press agent. If the guys all buy in, this squad has the potential to be great under AVB. COYS
peterballb
Raging, no one is going to fill the void of Modric. No one. That's why the valuation is 40M. He is, for Spurs, irreplaceable. Spurs can, however succeed without Modric. It is the beauty of the team game. Let's all just accept, he does not want to be here and thus move on, so how will we go forward? I believe we should play a 4-1-2-2-1. Parker or Sandro in front of the back 4 to protect the gut. 2 of Sigurdsson/Hudd/VDV in front with Bale and Lennon out wide and Adebayor up top. What we therefore need is an option for Lennon, Bale and Adebayor. I would argue Defoe does not fit. Add Ba/Dembele and Remy and you have three players that can play multiple positions and provide cover all over the MF and striker. Add Moutinho or Allen and you have a 4th with the quality necessary to complement Hudd/VDV/Sigurdsson. The future is in having players that can adapt to different circumstances. Bale cuts in, Sigurdsson cuts out left as happened on the goal against LA. That's what we need. It's all about team play. Anyone who watched today and was not impressed with the backside pressure we applied, not only by the starters, but all of the subs, was not watching the same match as I did or have not been watching Spurs these past 4 years. All of the MF was doing what Lennon does game in and game out, largely unheralded. This puts tremendous pressure on the opposition offence and turns the ball over. Also in both games, the defence became more comfortable with the system as the game went on. All with subs happening left, right and centre. It won't mean much until the Newcastle game, but there's lots I have taken from these games. Jenas, Bassong and Bentley are done. Gallas and Dawson have roles, but as support players. Sigurdsson is going to be one heck of a player for us. Naughton, who IMO, did not put a boot wrong today, will give solid cover to Walker and BAE. I'm very encouraged. Coming from someone who some continually call a doomsayer (I am not, I am a realist), one would think all on here would be tickled pink. In the next week I expect Pienaar and Modric to be gone, Jenas, Bentley and Bassong to get their last kicks at the can, Adebayor to join along with the Modric replacement, another striker, winger and keeper to then follow before our preseason match on August 9, where I expect the lineup to be pretty much the one that will face Newcastle on opening day.

Cannay wait and thanks to the generosity of ItalianYiddo, I will be enjoying the first 2 matches at WhiteHeart Lane as I celebrate 10 years of wedded bliss (away from the boys). The future is bright, the future is LillyWhite. COYS
peterballb
I honestly think that we are seriously gonna struggle this season after watching that performance I think the dark day are heading back to the lane so we need to get how arses in to gear and get some New faces in
rockerty rock8
rockerty, I believe there will be bumps. I also have not been this filled with anticipation since my early days of following this club. The days of Chivers, Pearce, Peters, Perryman, Gilzean, all managed by Bill Nicholson. AVB was not my first choice. He was not in my top 5. We are losing Modric. We have gained 5 quality young players (Caulker, Naughton, Fryers, Sigurdsson and Vertonghen). Gareth Bale has bought in and signed on, as has Walker. VDV is going nowhere. Nor is Lennon. By all accounts Adebayor is on his way. As per Levy, Modric will go only if replaced. Sandro is here for a while too. Parker three. I am having a lot of trouble seeing where we are worse unless people believe Harry was a great tactician and was the reason we won. I believe Harry told his favourites to go out, run about a bit and don't fuss the technicalities of the game. I believe AVB will bring the fundamentals and the structure that will get so much more out of the lads. There is always a risk. With a hack (my opinion) of a manager, we managed fourth. That's all on the players. We have finished 5th, 5th, 11th (CC win), 8th, 4th, 5th, 4th over the past 7 years. We are a CL contending team. So are 6 other teams. I find it hard to compare our lineups negatively with Arsenal, Liverpool, Newcastle, Chelsea. We're right in there. COYS
peterballb
Im no fan of Fat Sam - his tactics leave a lot to be desired and he comes across as bit of a tosser. But he is actually very forward thinking as a manager in many aspects. He was one of the first coaches certainly in the UK to introduce high intensity training methods with a big focus on Technology and Sports Science. He is actually lauded my many ex-players for this aswell and you cant argue with his record at smaller clubs. To call Fat Sam a bellend is one thing but to simply call him a mouthpiece is very misinformed imo.
HuddersfieldYiddo
I didt compare Pirlo with Hudd I used him as a example just to say being slow is not the end of the world, there are players in this world who are slow but they are best in their positions. Pirlo shined in world cup at 33 because i) he had 2 energitic midfielders De Rossi & Montolivo who had pace & creativity by his side. ii) obviously, when he got the space, he had the quality to deliver.

Being slow is only part of Hudd's game, there is more to him. The fact is he never played 30 games in a season either by injury or being overlooked in midfield. All I am saying, we have got a leaner Hudd, who has a good passing ability. Well, he is not Modric, but he is different player who could be used in a effective system.
sydqcb5
Huddersfield, there is a great deal more to coaching than conditioning. Yes,his practices were intense. His selections in matches left a lot to be desired and his results speak for themselves. He talks a great talk but at the end of the day, there was not much walking. Harry is loved by all of his favourites at every club. Doesn't make him a good coach. Both of their approaches lose their lustre very quickly. I view him and Harry in the same light as managers. I prefer Sam Allardyce, but he is nowhere near good enough. COYS
peterballb
@PeterB - You make some excellent points in regards to the general progress we are making under AVB. For the most part I tend to agree with you, but Perhaps I am a little more cautious. With 3 weeks to go, it would naive to think everything is going along swimmingly. The lack of activity in the transfer market is worrying, however you could be right in suggesting that once Kaka is moved on from RM, the wheel will start to turn and the transfer cycle will begin. I just feel there is still too much to organise before the season commences and that we will be slightly unprepared. The addition of Ade is extremely critical at this stage. His integration into the squad and one of familiarity with the players is vital for us. Our schedule however is quite favourable and it is imperative we get off to a good start. AVB & Spurs needs to put down a marker early, the pressure will be on from day 1. Finally, very nice of Italianyiddo to help you out with tickets. 1-0 to Vital Spurs Community.
thenuge
Point blanc. Kane is *****. People could not believe he would just stand there being so lethargic. My word! Even in 100 degree weather, at least I would be able to make a few decent tackles and race to win the ball.
dcruzer
Townsend, I dunno. He does not seem to show pace, and every other skill he has is nothing outstanding. Wish he could be like Raheem Sterling, as that kid was on fire and gave his all when allowed.
dcruzer
Bassong is, and always seem to want to be rubbish, as he only makes silly tackles. Bentley, showed no interest at all. He tried a few tricks to beat his man which made no difference to his end-game. Huddlestone is just too slow, and, thus, for a very long time will still be ineffective as any player could just take the ball away from him, even with his formidable body. Jake Livermore need to greatly improve in any one thing in order to contribute something significant to the team.
dcruzer
Only bright spot from that horrible performance (2nd half mostly) is that Tom Carroll tried some neat passing and overall showed he had real potential that can be attained soon if the tried harder.
dcruzer
After yesterdays performance we can obviously see what the team is lacking... who is putting in the effort and showing potential...and who needs to go (deadwood)...
Livermore and Naughton in my opinion put in a good performance and are looking like strong sqaud members.
Jenas, Gallas, Bentley and Bassong need to be shown the door as soon as possible... send them to Division 2...
Harry Kane.. wot a load of *****ee...i would have rather seen Coulibaly given the chance. Kane couldnt score in a brothel..not even in my squad at the moment.. and why didnt Coulibaly get a run out for 20 minutes...
Hudd's eye for a pass impressed me... hes lost a bit of weight and is showing that he is up for it... im thinking he could hit a fly on the head from 50yards..
Siggy and Bale were quiet but i think they will have a good rapour this season...
Lets not forget that the game was played in serious heat..
And the pitch was useless.. made the ball look like it was made of lead...

We are so in need of fire-power.. 2 strikers and a serious playmaker.... Id go with HULK, ADE and MOUTINHO... or somewhere along those lines... we need to pressure the opposition... we where just falling short of that yesterday.. but then again it was a "Friendly"... Charlie Adam you (unt...
Yidmarks
Townsend and Carroll both look like they are up for it.. and they will be great squad members with the big schedule we have this season.. Townsend really impressed me with his attacking play... he knows that he has to impress or go out on loan again... got my vote...
Yidmarks
Peterbalb - you can in no way say that Jenas is better than Hudd. Hudd has at least put in a full season where we got out highest points total. What has Jenas done, apart from never achieving his full potential? Tenboon - I agree with you that Kaboul is no where near captaincy yet. His sendings off are ALWAYS due to dissent. Which shows lack of control and temperament for the role. How can you organise the team, when you cannot organise yourself? If he cuts that out, and puts in another season or two of good performances, then i would consider him. I am also fed up of people saying that Harry failed. This is ludicrous. He was never given a proper ride. Avb hasn't even had a ball kicked in anger yet and already he has had more investment in the squad than Harry had all last season. Yet Harry still achieved our second best Premiership season! Some failure. Harry saved us from likely relegation. Got us 4th, 5th, 4th - two of which were our best ever Epl seasons, and quarter finals of Cl. Some failure. Job done. What people are not liking is his personaility and the nature of his temporary employment, plus his restrictions in the transfer market, and his choice of player. Which is fine. hate that. But how can you do better than all that came before you and failed? If you talk aboute squad, then Avb had five players who had won Epl three times, and plus Essien who had won it twice and a few others who had won it once. Players who had been.there and done it. Avb took them and turned them into sixth place quality. THAT is failing. Avb better do better this time around, because none of the Spurs squad have won a prem title. Harry established Hudd, Dawson as first team players. He rescued Bale from the reserves, he made Ekotto and Gomes work, he got Defoe to finally have a good season - yes these players were already there but he did put in coaching and tactics. No one thinks he is a genius, but he does coach and his work paid off. You cannot have zero coaching ability and guide Spurs, West ham and Pompey to their best seasons in the Epl can you? I am concerned at how deluded people are when it comes to Avb. He may be the long term solution, but he has alot to learn. It is likely to take time.
TonyRich
@dcruzer - correct and whole heatedly agree with all 4 posts :). I just do not like the actual physical look of Kane either. Why is his mouth always open gasping for air?
thenuge
Joe Allen, Benat Extebarria, Gaston Ramirez, Ade, Hulk, Mountinho, .... why not use Freund's pulling power to lure Bastian Schweinsteiger to the lane... might want a new challenge...while ur there bring Muller and Gomez with you...
Yidmarks
Dzagoev... is the type of gritty player we need... gets stuck in and fights for every ball..
Yidmarks

ADE(Striker 1)
FALCAO or HULK (push the boat out for one of them)
REMY (Striker 3, also can be used on the wing)
DEFOE (Striker 4)
COULIBALY (Striker 5 - free squad pick due to age, i think?)
JOE ALLEN (possible playmaker)
BENAT EXTEBARRIA (my personal choice as playmaker)
FERNANDINHO (offers pace and striking abilty)
GASTON RAMIREZ (winger that attacks and shoots)
MATEO KOVACIC (big prospect, a future Ratface)
LUIS SUAREZ (offer the bin-dippers 35m and tap him up)
BERBATOV (still has goals left in those boots for 5m)
M'BAYE NIANG (one for the future, one to look out for)
LEWANDOWSKI (proven scorer, but can he do it in the PL?)
GUISEPPE ROSSI (sounds like he's available)
DAMAIO (looks unlikely, but pure class in front of goal)
MOUTINHO (the man in the middle)
SCHWEINSTEIGER (a possibilty if hes up for a new challenge)
DZAGOEV (the fella fights for everything a real poacher)

WE NEED THOSE 3 BIG SIGNINGS NOW... A PLAYMAKER OF SERIOUS QUALITY... AND THE 2 "BIG GUN" STRIKERS... NOW NOW NOW... COYS ILIT...
Yidmarks
I for one don't agree with you guys re our goal keeping. friedel and Gomes are good enough for this season. Problem is you guys don't respect Friedel's positioning sense. MSG times he doesn't have to make a great stop because he's usually in the right place.
jvd
TonyRich, Peterballb didnt say Jenas was better than Hudd.. I think that was the person he was replying to..
Guyver
jvd - I want to keep Friedel for one reason only. That is we could get 10-20 years from him as our GK coach. He could even end up our assistant manager or even manager. Great communicator, got a very intelligent head on his shoulders, uses science to stay very fit and clearly his influence on younger keepers would be great. As 1st team starter this season, I'm not convinced. I thought his lack of agility and his unwillingness to be brave and come off his line cost us.

Gomes is interestingly about the same age as Friedel was when Liverpool discarded him. He is now at that age where he has the maturity and calmness to be great for Spurs. He can probably now get over a mistake and bring levels of consistency to his game. My guess is his decision making is probably going to be way better than his instinctive nature beforehand.
muttley
Let's also remember that under Harry, we had to make 24m in player sales in 2 years just to break even as a club. That's not conjecture by the way, that is written into our published financial reports and it happened as we had a bunch of players we were paying for but not utilising. What is happening this summer is a breath of fresh air. It had to happen as Harry build no foundations to his squad. He just kept topping it up with players who get one year older and one year worse every year. It was about to fall apart and he got out at the right time to save face.

I just hope AVB keeps going with the culling and takes out Cudicini, Bassong, Jenas and Bentley. With Gio coming to the end of his contract and Modric and Pienaar inevitably off that takes us down to 23 senior players. We can probably loan out Rose and Falque and bring that down further to 21 players. With cups and Europa that leaves plenty of space for Button, Caulker, Carroll, Fryers and Townsend to be integrated in.

I don't get the pessimism by some. A couple of draws in 100 deg heat with some non-first teamers doesn't suddenly make us mid table mediocrity.
muttley
Charlie Adam is CRAP!!!!! and Bale was brillant until Charlie ***** head hacked him down !! Is that what Brendon Rodgers calls passing football???
redhotspur1234
Got my first first on a fulham article, I'm ecstatic ;-), I would like nothing more than to punch Charlie Adam square in the eyebrow the bloke is a grade A stain and he was lucky Sandro wasn't there.
Tottingham10
Saturday the 18th of August it all kicks off, away to the Barcodes @ 5-30pm in the Prem. With 3 more Pre-Season Fixtures remaining New York Red Bulls on the 31st, then Watford Aug 5th and away to Valencia Aug 9th...That's it, reading over some of the post's and not see all of the two games to date, What POSITIVES have come from them? Can anyone tell me, because we all know Jenas; Bentley and Bassong offer very little to both the team and IMO the squad, having to play these guys in any Prem Fixture is a backward step, With yet another sad day for Defoe, his cousin getting killed in a swimming pool accident, his the only class striker we have, What does Harry Kane bring to the table? Gio Mexico; Sandro Brazil; and Caulker and Rose Team GB all on Olympic duty, Caulker looks good, Sandro we know what we have. What's to become of the other two? Pienaar looking set to return to Everton and Modric at some point leaving if Madrid come up with the money, IMO we are short, well short of a midfield playmaker and god knows how many strikers short, we have the same problem as last season, no like for like cover for Lennon or Bale if any of these two get injured, which will happen, we are stuck with no options of real class. It was mentioned Jenas passed the ball 13 times all backwards, his really improved then. NEGATIVES plenty; POSITIVES ? Siggy and Vert that's it.
spu 4 life
Well the way I see it is that the defence should get about 10 goals between them Van Der Vaart should get 10-15 Sigurdsson should get 10-15 Bale should get 10-15 Defoe 15-20 So we should get about 50-60 goals So at the moment we are about 30 goals short of where we need to be so Sell Modric and then sign Adebayor, Allen and dembele hopefully those 3 players would be able to get 25-35 goals All i know is that we NEED to HURRY UP AND BUY A STRIKER also is anyone worried that AVB says we only need 3 strikers !!!!! Because Defoe,Adebayor and Harry Kane are not enough but also not good enough either what happens if they get injured !! Will we end up playing 4-6-0 with no striker??? Also what do people think of the idea of playing Bale as a striker ???
redhotspur1234
I am down-grading my predictions to about 6th 1. Manchester City 2. Chelsea 3. Manchester united 4. Arsenal 5. Liverpool 6 Spurs 7. Newcastle 8. Everton :(
redhotspur1234
One last thing I missed in my previous posts. Jenas is utter rubbish of the worse kind, the lack of will to give his all is insulting. Should never pull on a Spurs shirt.
dcruzer
Well said spu 4 life. So many gaps in the squad with only 2 weeks remaining before the community shield game kicks off. It was only after the Adam tackle on Bale yesterday, that I realised how paper thin our squad really is. Kind of slipped my mind that, "we've sold his back up"! Kranc and Pienaar werent like for like, but they were good established premiership players. What about Lennon as well? Its a mess at the moment. You'd have to be crazy not to be at least slightly concerned. We've followed this blueprint before, back in 08/09.. it didnt work. In fact, we still havent recovered from the Berba sale, took us years to recover from the sale of Carrick.. why would anyone be confident that this situation will be any different? because from where im standing it looks eerily familiar. Lots of work to be done, and a new system being implemented on players who we don't even expect to play much of a role next season. Clocks ticking..
Guyver
"Also what do people think of the idea of playing Bale as a striker" Desperate... although I reckon he could possibly be moulded into 1, but we don't have the time or resources to be that experimental.
Guyver
the nuge, I did not say things were going swimmingly, just that they are, IMO, going in the right direction. Euros and now the Olympics have made transfers more difficult. Further the economics are not getting any better. That said, I believe it has all given AVB to let players sort out their own fates. It does appear we have a couple imminently on their way. We have 3 in and 2 back from loan. We have released dead wood. More will likely be sold. We still need 2 strikers, one of which will be Ade. We still need a winger. Still need Modric replacement if he's off. GK still needs to be looked at as it really could be in a huge mess in 18 months. If nothing has been done when we go to Newcastle, I'll be beside myself. I expect the team to be pretty much set by the 9th of August with a few pieces of driftwood to still move on. COYS
peterballb
 

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