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Top 4 favourites with an amazing manager?

It really bugs me that people think Everton are a better side than us and that Moyes is a better manager than AVB. 

I'm going to make a prediction right here, Everton will finish 8th this season. Lets look at the facts. Spurs have played Chelsea, Man U and Man City so far. Everton have faced just Man U, and that was at home. Everton have been incredibly lucky with injuries from the start. Take Jagielka, Baines, Neville, Fellaini and Jelavic out of their team, and they would be in 11th. 

Tottenham have been missing Kaboul, BAE, Parker, Dembele and Adebayor for large chunks of, and in some cases the entire season up until this point. Don't forget that we have also been playing mid-week games in Greece and Slovenia. All this considered, Everton are only 3 points ahead of us. Thats not impressive. 

If Everton finish 4th, I will personally go to the Emirates next season for Arsenal vs Chelsea, in my Spurs shirt with Adebayor on the back. Not going to happen. On the matter of Moyes, I feel he has played a PR blinder in recent years, talking about how 'money's always tight', 'we don't have the resources to compete', etc, etc. It's nonsense, Fellaini cost £15M and has been on about £70K per week since he arrived. They have spent plenty of money on other players like Mirallas, Pienaar and Jelavic, who will all be on wages comparable to Spurs players. 

Martinez has done a great job at Wigan, Moyes has been mediocre. He is nearly as overrated as his team. He has struggled against an ever declining Liverpool in their local derbies for years, and has never won a trophy. AVB as won 3 pieces of silverware, worked for Porto, Chelsea, Inter Milan and Totteham Hotspurs and is only 35 years old. Also, Moyes has had 10 years at Everton, AVB 4 months at Spurs, and they are just 3 points ahead of us after only 11 games. 

AVB is far better than Moyes. This may seem like a pointless rant, but I felt it important to contrast our current position with that of a club that everyone is currently hailing, and with a manger that many thought we should have gone after to replace Harry. 

Despite being a 'work in progress' we are actually in a pretty good position considering we have a new manager, an injury crisis, lost two of our best players and are only 3 point from 4th spot. I will also predict that Spurs finish 4th, 5 points ahead of Arsenal and probably 15 ahead of Everton!

Written by Tactically Challenge

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The journalist

Writer: Tactically Challenge Mail feedback, articles or suggestions

Date:Friday November 16 2012

Time: 5:47PM

Your Comments

big cockeral. He got them 4th, not CL. Big difference, especially in terms of cash!
Tactically Challenge
To be fair to Moyes, he's only spent more that £10m on a single player twice in his whole time at Everton. You cherry picked 1 of them in Fellaini for £15m, with the other being Yakubu for £11m. We spent more than £10m on 2 players in the last transfer window alone.
big cockeral. I agree, he does seem clever but dull. I think AVB also needs help from Levy, you can't buy average players and expect them to replace footballers good enough to play for Real Madrid.
Tactically Challenge
Guyver, I did cherry pick admittedly. But Fellaini wasn't just over £10M, he was over £15M!!! Thats only just shy of our transfer record. The real point is that we are doing better than can be expected considering all the facts. Oh, and I obviously have an irrational hatred of david Moyes!
Tactically Challenge
Fellaini was £15m, but we've bought the likes of Bentley, Bent, Modric, Defoe, Berbatov, Dembele, Lloris and much more for between £10m and £17m. Its not nonsense that Moyes has usually had to work with a limited budget compared to his nearest rivals.
Pavlyuchenko £14m Palacios £12m, we've wasted a lot of money down the years.
On the topic of chairman, people have to consider perspectives, whilst I think both Big C and Tacitally Challenge are wrong, you're also right at the same time. Lets take Levy, from our point of view, he's a genius, because in twelve or so years he wil have almost doubled our stadium size, put us in with a shout of being a consistent champions league qualifier, built a state of the art training center and got affiliations and partnerships our previous chairman could have only dreamed of. On the other hand, if I was AVB, i'd hate him, whilst what he does for the club is right, it's right for the long term, we would never ever ever ever, did i mention ever? Go bust under Levy, he would not and could not let it happen with his strategy. There's a lot of balloon teams in the league that find themselves with money for a few years only not to retain it.(Cough Aston Villa). I understand why AVB would be frustrated, some streategies and club changes/transfers will appeal to either the manger or the chairman, very rarely both. I have fiath in them both, I love the God that is Levy anyway.
Also, I'd like to put my neck our for Guyver here as I dont think this was an article intended to slate Moyes, more praise AVB and actually, answer the media's questions of AVB, with the response 'You're talking nonsense!"
Sorry, I meant TC
You should not try to compare the budgets of Everton and Spurs, one his owned by a modestly rich millionaire in Bill Kenwright, who struggles to give David Moyes the meagre resources, which he manages very well, by identifying players that are realistically obtainable like Cahill, Baines, Jagelka, Lescott, Pienaar, Neville, Fellaini, Hietinga, Jelavic, Howard, Mieralas etc.etc. rather than make alleged attempts to sign "superstars" they have no chance of getting, and then with the resident journeymen like Osman and Hibbitt an a few younger unknowns like Coleman, moulds them into a no frills, hard to beat, reasonably competitive PL squad. Compare that to us, with a multi-billionaire owner, with the financial capability to make resources available, to propel this club forward, but refuses to do so, and what resources that are grudgingly made available, are to large extent wasted on "square peg in round hole" signings, some of which have been listed in revious posts, and equally bizaar managerial appointments i.e. 8 and counting under the ENIC banner. We kid ourselves that we are a prudent, well run club, compared to Everton we are positively extravagent. The other thing is that David Moyes unlike the last, and the current Spurs managers, does not involve himself in bull $hit pedddling to the media, they liked/like to demonstate either their comedic talent, or their overly complex grasp of the English language. Unusually for me David Moyes is an interloper from over the border, that I quite respect.
Regarding the CL, yes Everton finished 4th and then got eliminated from the preliminary round of the CL under David Moyes. No Spurs manager has achieved similar, or better, save one, that of course was HR who by general concensus on here was crap, so apparently finishing in a CL place is something not to be admired at Spurs anyway so why hol that against Moyes. We will just wat and see whether AVB can build a 10 year dynasty at Spurs.
Incidently yes we have played Chelsea, Man Utd, and Man C, but we have also played 6 teams who at the time of the game were in the bottom 6, so we haven't exactly had a bad deal with fixtures.
Wow. The negativity of Spurs fans never fails to surprise me. Strange, some Spurs fans are actually defensive about another teams manager. Perhaps the word 'fans' should be replaced by something else.
Tactically Challenge
In all fairness TC you've worded this quite aggressively to Mr Moyes,. What's wrong with defending other manager's who are wrongly accused? It's not negative at all, the bit's about AVB are positive and I think correct, but that's what this should have been more about, bigging up AVB which I thought you were trying to do, not to slate Moyes who lets be honest you must admire and respect for many reasons.
I agree, Everton would have struggled, maybe worse than us, with injuries equivalent to ours. However, for the budget they have had over the years, you gotta give credit to Moyes. Everton are a very proud, historic club, with fantastic fans (take note everyone: that is one aspect of our respective clubs that they are superior in right now!), with a history to brag about above our own. Good luck to them (althogh, I won't be saying that if we are both level on points going for 4th come the last day of the season).
Gerrard may have exaggerated, but I know what he meant by "Everton play like Stoke". Moyes certainly gets them up for games, but they do their fare share of kicking lumps out of the opposition. Often play good football on Match of the Day but pretty hard work when you have to watch them for 90mins.If Moyes was that good he would have moved on by now.
matt hoten
We will not beat Arsenal and not even be in the top 10 because we have a nut as a manager It is not the fault of the players but when you see a manager praising every team that beat us then you begin to think Just be glad when he has gone so that we can play a good game of football
Jimzoaar_The_Yid. The main point was to praise AVB, your right. But to defend another teams manager so strongly and attack our own, even though they are only 3 points apart, is pretty disappointing. I still believe Moyes is over rated, Pardew and Wenger deserve a lot more praise based on their transfer spend to results ratio.
Tactically Challenge
Good thread. Why do we assume that Moyes could handle the man management of a more talented squad? Real easy when your top 11 are obvious and you are not playing Europa. At the same time, like rooting for little guy Everton over still arrogant old news "big club" Liverwurst. Considering the quality of the five names TC mentions, we are showing some real squad depth. For me, really want Dembele back: strength, stamina and skill. Once Huddlestone is 60 mins in right now, he has nothing in the tank and we have the big midfield gaps. That's why Carroll (probably too soon) once he got into the Europa game was very interesting. COYS
PAV 14 sold for 8 overall 6 mill .. modric 16 sold 30 14 profit berbatov 11 sold 31 VDV bought 11 sold 9 hmmmmmmmmmmmm I think the funds to buy is not an issue Moyes is an overated *****.
PAV 14 sold for 8 overall 6 mill .. modric 16 sold 30 14 profit berbatov 11 sold 31 VDV bought 11 sold 9 hmmmmmmmmmmmm I think the funds to buy is not an issue Moyes is an overated *****.
Howard (Flop at Man U to hero at the Toffees), Baines (Lower league buy) Lescott (lower league buy) Jagielka (lower league buy) Coleman (came through the club) Cahill (lower league buy) Pienaar (Got him playing great football pre and post his Spurs spell -- man-management anyone?) Osman (great pro = not big money, and great man management) Rodwell (came through the club) Jelaviv (bought from the seriously lower SPL) -- To name a few off the top of my head. Oh, and add Rooney (came through the club) and Felliani (ONE REAL big-money buy, and man, what a f888kin buy!) -- so that and that all equates to Moyes ticking boxes such as 1: A club record buy that lived up to the price tag! See all the big money guys we brought in for the adverse comparison! 2) Successful manager at bringing through youth from within the club. See Steven Caulker being a HOPE (I rate him!) for us in that regard ... last one that really worked for us? Ledders! That's a poor, poor return. 3) Great spotter of talent from the Championship. Can't recall the last time we picked one from there (See Bostock et al). Yes, so I agree with anyone disrespecting Moyes here: A totally overated *****? Puleeeze!!
Well said SpursEagle, can't see how Moyes is overrated. He consistently meets his targets in terms of league position and occasionally "overachieves" a well, not a lot more you an ask from a manager. On spotting talent from the championship, the 2 Kyle's? Also Bale, Lennon, Thudd, Dawson from previous years.
Guyver -- Okay, you just kicked my arse on the Championship spotting! Damn you! lmao! Although I will nit-pick with Lennon. We bought that guy at the same time as Robinson in the season they went down. Everyone else you mentioned? Spot on. I take that back! Don't get too cocky, mate ... I'll get you back for this! Ha ha!
Ha, we'll see about that ;)
I'm not a big fan of Moyes but respect what he's done for Everton. AVB would not have been my first choice for us but I really hope he does the business for us
Let's give him this season and see what he does. Is it me or does anyone else think we're jinxed with all the injuries we constantly seem to have?
So on the one hand Everton have a much weaker squad than we do, on the other hand Moyes is a crap manager despite what he achieves with that weak squad. This is a really poorly thought through piece of writing. The key difference between Moyes and just about every Spurs manager I can think of is he understands the importance of attitude. He instils a will to win in his teams that sometimes enables them to punch well above their weight, something we just seem incapable of doing.
u said it yourself, a pointless rant.
You and I don't often agree, but this time you are absolutely spot on.
***** me, Spurs really are a bitter lot, cannot handle other teams having success, crying and trying to belittle Everton's start to the season and trying to make an excuse for Spurs' start to the season, my God, it is embarrassing and not a good look for your club. Then to make some stupid and childish prediction about Everton finishing 8th and Spurs 4th, tops it off. This Everton side have been playing like this sine January, and it doesn't look like stopping, in fact, we are only getting better and better, 1 defeat in the last 20 speaks volumes to that, and our football has been brilliant, the amount of times we have created 30 chances in a game is amazing and to create the most chances throughout the major European league (yes, more than the likes of Bayern Munich, City, Barca and Madrid) is a testament tot he football we are playing. This article has just turned me off Spurs entirely now, reminds me of Liverpool supporters this season as well. Another thing "overrated side?" Have you watched Everton this season? If you want an overrated side, need to look no further than yourselves, this season is living proof of that.
I totally disagree with the whole article. AVB has a lot more to prove in the premiership. Moyes has overachieved many seasons with Everton with the squad he had. I don't know if they will finish 4th but I doubt that we will finish far better than them, and if we finish above them it will be because our depth in squad and quality not because of a brilliant AVB that does shocking substitutions every weekend.
congratultions on the worst article of the year. Is Moyes better than abv???yes yes yes, however you want to judge it, he is better and should be our manager if Levy acually picked the best man for the job. You are everything wrong with spurs fans by saying anybody who doesn't agree isnt a proper fan. Youre a disgrace.
Rob-EFC, if you read through the posts, you'll find most Spurs fans disagree with the negativity directed at Everton in this article.
Everton never have any transfer funds the majority of the time and yet are starting to emerge as a really good side, this is down to team stability, most of the players have played together for over 4 seasons (I think it is even longer fortheir defence - which is the biggest plus) but because their manager has been in charge for over ten years which gives the team more confidence. spurs are definately the better side maybe only fellani, baines and jagielka could get into our side at the minute and that is only because of our persistant injuries. Dont expect Everton to be anywhere near 4th at the end of the season as they havent got decent replacements if their best players get injured, I expec the likes of fellani and baines will be gone either in jan or june as well.
How can anyone praise AVB? The man has shown nothing whatsoever in his time at Tottenham so far to suggest he should even be managing in this league.
The reason this article was written is that even the supporters who are desperately defending AVB suspect after 4 defeats in last five matches we should have appointed an experienced British manager.Anyway AVB will get a full season but he must keep up encouraging signs by playing Adebayor ( after suspension ) and Defoe together and not going negative when we are only 1-0 up with most of the game to go. Everything depends on how quickly he can learn from mistakes but Jimzoaar going into denial and not wanting to face the truth will not help you if the defeats continue. So some good signs but so far you have to say was better under Redknapp
The reason AVB was appointed is that Levy thought he would be compliant due to his experiences at Chelsea and he was desperate for another chance.Better choices available like Rodgers and Lambert were rejected as they would tell Levy where to go. He was probobly afraid Lambert would give him the "Glasgow kiss ". We may live to regret overlooking those two let alone Moyse but I genuinely hope I am wrong
I cannot believe that I am reading an article glorifying AVB and trying to put down Moyes. You are using AVBs resume from Porto? Guess how many times Porto won the league in the last 12 years! 10! Only once with AVB and that is a two team league. Sure, his accomplishment in Europa is great and his record there was great but the PL is another league and as of today he has done nothing in this league to justify any praise. I have yet to hear anyone outside of Spurs fans hoping he is the next SAF say anything positive about him. So to write an article glorifying AVB while trying to trash Moyes who has done as much as possible with minimal investment is just beyond me.
If come May AVB has us in a 4th place spot or if we are challenging strongly I will gladly suck up my pride and admit my view of him was wrong but as of today he has already dropped us out of the cup and we have looked beyond average in a weak Europa league group. We are also coming of 3 consecutive losses in the PL and dropping out of the cup. I have nothing against AVB as a man but I simply never thought he was the man for the job. I am not preaching what if HR anymore because thats done and gone. We have to figure out what our next step will be in the case that this fails. We may all not see eye to eye in everything but we all have the best intention of supporting the Spurs and the days we all agree are the days we are winning and I miss those days.

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