UK time is: 18:54:33
Vital Login
Social Login

Choose your club

Other Sites

Network Navigation

Vital Partners

'If It's Football, It's Vital'

A Blessing Undisguised?

So it would appear that we have seen the last of Emmanuel Adebayor, at least for a few weeks.

Now I hold my hands up by stating that I believed he was a good buy for us in the summer, and I still have a feeling that the structure of the deal made by Mr Levy may well allow us to move him on in the summer, with little or no loss financially, because he is now in a position where his wages are not so stupidly high to put off 99% of clubs and the extra 1% didn't want or need him. Today and for most of his appearances this season, however, my initial optimism has all but disappeared.

Of course there were some big question marks over his signing on from City. First and foremost, he does have a bit of a reputation for losing focus and love for his clubs. Add to that we changed managers, with no absolute certainty that AVB really wanted him and only took him because it was him or trying to convert Heurelho Gomes back into a striker. Add different tactics, injuries and the form of Jermain Defoe and seemingly a lack of chemistry between the pair, and we have plenty or reasons to lament our decision to bring back the player, despite his success last season.

There does remain the debate over whether Adebayor would work better alone, with one of Dempsey or Sigurdsson supporting and that like so many strikers, he lives or dies on confidence, something which he appears to have lost, but also he still seems incapable of playing quick incisive football, and as with last season, despite scoring a good percentage of goals and assists, is the one Spurs player that has me pulling my hair out, because I can't decide whether he doesn't quite have the ability or simply doesn't have the hunger. How often, this or last season are you shouting at him for his terrible touch, hanging on to the ball for to long, lacking vision, or simply not attacking the ball or the opposition player? The answer is loads!

Losing Adebayor for up to six weeks, may well leave AVB short on options and Defoe short on rest, but will this force us back into playing more towards a 4-2-3-1/4-4-1-1 formation, perhaps more an AVB ideal, but also one that will bring back the best in Defoe, whilst also giving more game time to the in form Dempsey and the improving Sigurdsson. As a contrast, I have also wondered if this represents an opportunity for Jon Obika to at least have a chance to break into the squad. He may never play for Spurs again, but would he have done any worse that Emmanuel if he has played eighteen times this season?

This isn't meant to be a dig at Adebayor, more a look at whether his absence actually brings us improvement in goals and form from our striking two. The stats clearly show that Adebayor has really struggled for goals, with two in the league (Arsenal, Reading) and one Europa success against Panathinaikos. I know goals aren't everything, but 3 in 18 appearances isn't what we expect or need. If goals don't happen, the least you expect is for supreme effort as a compensation.

Jermain's stats still look good with 16 in 33 games, but when paired with Adebayor in a 4-4-2, he looks a shadow of the player that many (including myself) doubted could ever play as a lone striker. Initially I thought that a partnership between Adebayor and Defoe would work very well, and whilst I still feel they have the physical qualities to work together, I now doubt they have the mental ones. Sure Jermain got a great hat-trick against Maribor, when I felt they played really well individually, however did they clic as a pair? Not for me!

Since that game, Defoe has scored six goals in fourteen games, which isn't a million miles from his whole season stats, however his double brace against Fulham and West Ham were achieved without Adebayor in the side. Suddenly strikers with two in twelve and the other with three in eighteen simply doesn't look good enough, so whether Adebayor stayed or went, I think AVB needed to do something, whether that was to bang their heads together and make them work as a pair, or accept they can't or won't work together and play one or the other.

Over the next few games, we might well have a conclusion to this debate. Perhaps we will see a new striker join. Perhaps Defoe will suddenly re-find his form on his own, or finally we realise that Defoe is simply tired and losing form as a result of too many minutes, too soon in the season. Personally I have a feeling that a pairing of Defoe and Dempsey next weekend will be impressive, with Jermain working and moving with greater freedom and energy than we have seen him for a few weeks. West Ham and Fulham to be exact.

Perhaps as fans we also need to take note. Many of us were demanding we return to a 4-4-2 and also insisting we play Defoe and Adebayor or just play Adebayor. At the time, it may well have been because neither Clint or Gylfi had settled, so we do have a legitimate get out of jail free card. Did AVB agree with us, bow or capitulate to fan pressure at a time when we were struggling as a team?

Now one or both of our main strikers either need to alter their ego's or accept they can't play together and as a result will probably play less games. Jermain now has a great opportunity to not only prove that he has the hunger and ability to play on his own, but also perhaps the club from bringing in a new striker to replace not only him, but Adebayor as well...




Use your social login to comment on front page articles. Login using you Facebook, Twitter, Google or LinkedIn accounts and have your say!



Click here to join in the debate on the club forum.

The journalist

Writer: OxfordSpur Mail feedback, articles or suggestions

Date:Monday January 14 2013

Time: 9:37AM

Your Comments

Please Mr Levy we need a striker, I thought Remy would have been worth a gamble.
Yido T
Whether Adebayor goes or stays, we need a striker.
Shannon
You have missed the main point here I feel - WE NEED A NEW STRIKER. If we don't get one in before the United match I would expect to see Parker and Sandro in the middle with Dembele pushed further up in a three man midfield. As Liverpool showed yesterday in the second half, if you sit on Carrick in the middle of the pitch then the supply is cut off. Parker, Sandro and Dembele on top of Carrick and Cleverley and we could see a positive result...
Sebthespur
I don't think they really click as a pair because both want to be the focal point...Ade to his credit has come back from injury and taken the role of provider but you can see it doesn't sit well with him. We had an opportunity to play Ade up top on his own against QPR with Gylfi or Dempsey supporting for me that was the perfect time to see if a) Ade was up for it (b he could score c) Gylfi could work the 10 role (d not alienate Defoe as he was being protected for the run of games whilst Ade was away e) would mean we still had time in the window to address the situation....but now we have to play defoe not knowing when Ade comes back what part he's still got a part to play...and we have to make a decision on a striker in the next 2 weeks....
shedboy2
I feel Defoe's game has not been the same since Ade got back into the side. Defoe started slow with the lone striker role and at first it didn't work but credit to him and the manager he embraced it worked hard and we started to pay dividends. however, Siggy and Dempsey were woeful and many of us wanted Ade as we thought with Defoe on fire and Ade return we would be awsome but it hasn't happened. Defoe is no longer on fire and Ade has been poor.

Why this is could be a number of reasons 1) egos between the striker 2) Defoe no longer has the room to move as much 3) Defoe has stopped working because psychologically he doesn't feel like no 1 again and because he feels he has a partner now and doesn't need to work so hard 4) Ade slows up our game 5) Ade doesn't like AVB instructions 6) Ade wants to be no 1 7) Ade is being Ade he has got his money and he is not bothered 8) The pair just cannot play together 9) Both are not good enough to be consistent 10) Formation is not working.

Now when Ade came back Dempsey and Siggy were benched but now we have seen an improvement from both of them. Although I still not sure they are the answer to what we want to achieve. I think Ade away will give AVB an opportunity to start Dempsey and hopefully we will see him continue to improve and Defoe to get back to his goal scoring if that happens then it is simple don't change it when Ade comes back.

However, it may all go pear shaped and we may see that Defoe doesn't find is form again and Dempsey just doesn't deliver either and this will point towards non of the players being good enough including Ade.

There is a possibility Ade could play with Dempsey and Defoe dropped but has Ade done enough to warrant being no 1. He like all players should earn their place and Ade hasn't taken his chances imo. He has been lazy, poor touch, too slow and woeful in front of goal.

I am actually happy he has gone because I am fed up of watching him. Every time he goes for a header he doesn't win it. Every time he gets the ball he loses it or is too slow in moving it on and he has brought nothing in terms of goals, assists and general work ethic.

I am getting concerned about Defoe's recent form and I am hoping this improves now Ade is away and he gets scoring again and starts to up his work rate.

Personally as we all know we need a sharp prolific striker to show them how it is done and kick them both up the bum. I am not going against Defoe because he is Spurs through and through and did well under AVB in the beginning when things were difficult but now Ade is away if he doesn't step up I will start to feel against him regardless that I really like him. There is no excuse for laziness for any player.
thfan
you have to assume that we dont fancy Remy or rather AVB doesn't. perhaps that means we are actively trying to get someone else or a different type of player. it is interesting to see how AVB seems totally disinterested in certain players that fans almost demand we sign. Sahin is a perfect second example. seems he nailed it with that decision,
oxfordspur
Let me start by saying that Saturdaysí match was the worst game of football and by far the most lack lustre performance ive seen all season. Dembele was utterly useless and got completely bossed by míbia. Apart from the opening 10 mins at the start and 10mins after half time we posed absolutely no threat. The need for a striker is so blindingly obvious I cant believe it. ADE gave the worst performance from a professional footballer I have seen in a long time. Quite frankly, I wouldnít play him again this season. Dempsey had 3 touches in 20mins when he came on. We are missing that bit of extra class, to get that bit of class we need to spend the money. We are on a good run of from at present but itís not taking 3 points against the bottom of the league that will cost us in the long run. Once again we find ourselves in the position where if we spend a few quid now we will raep the rewards at the end of the season. Once again I bet we will make the same mistake. One thing that showed the difference for me was when Lloris threw the ball out to parker, only for him to turn around and pas it back to dawson, at which point Lloris went mental! He has played at a club with a winning mentality. That is the difference.
hudderspur
Without Ade in the side could we expect Dawson to stop hoofing the ball up ? I'm already fed up with it !
RamsesV
I agree SB2, AVB should have used JD as the impact sub on Saturday. Crazy to leave out Dempsey when he's on a roll. And taking Lennon off when Walker was already exposed has brought back all my concerns about his tactical substitutions.
Love totty
LT- yep missed a trick and after winning the manager of the month award....still most managers go on a strong run after winning that don't they....:(
shedboy2
Why not have a cheeky punt on Darren Bent? He's good in the system we play in, out of favour at Villa and could represent value for money at this time of year... He wouldn't have to contend with the Berbatov/Keane partnership with Defoe in the wings or have a manager that tells the general public his 'missus would have scored that header'
nzyido
oxfordspur- re: Remy Or we just can't compete with them as they are a big club....(someone will bite)
shedboy2
Darren Bent....phuck sake im glad some of you lot aint the gaffer. Why dont we get Crouchy back on loan as well.
hudderspur
i have to say there has been some sparkle between the front pair...
SpursWho
Reckon Adebayor has got the goods too but is a form player and needs the arm round his shoulder to be told he is the man. He had a protracted transfer, was injured at the start of the year, got sent off just after getting back in the side, said it wasn't going to be his year shortly after. Give him some time...
nzyido
bahaha Hudderspur, what's your suggestion? Can see the problems within the team highlighted in your post but no solution ;-)
nzyido
torress torress torress sale sale sale big sale sale big sale....buy him for freeeeee freeeee freeee freeeee freeee...yes you heard right its freeee freeee freee freeee....no extra cost will be delivered at your place with no charge at all...no hidden charges....its freeeee....sale sale sale sale torress torress freeee freee freee...
shlok27
Ade & Defoe = No chemistry. Oil and water, both useful in their own individual ways but simply cannot get on the same wavelength when it comes to football. Ade needs to find the form of last season. I am hoping he can find his mojo with Togo and come back strong for the final third of the season. Defoe is an awkward striker and in the grand scheme of things is an average footballer, but he is with us, no one else will buy him, so we have to find a way to make it work. We'll find out in the coming weeks whether he can 'co-operate' with other forwards. Plenty of games coming up, so maybe we'll see a Dempsey / Siggy combo up front. I still say a 15 million bid for Michu is the best bet for us.
thenuge
Solution is get some quality in the team. Dempsey Siggy are both average Journeyman IMO. They are not going to win matches. There are plenty of players out there who would add so much creativity in the midfield or strikers who could score the goals. Up front, my choices that would fit into the clubs ďyouth policyĒ and wouldnít cost £35m each would be Ricky Van Wolfswinkle (23) or Bojan Krkic (22). Two very different types of striker but it all depends on the system etc that AVB wants to play. As a straight out and out no9 I canít think of any reason why we havenít gone in for Llorente.
hudderspur
Ade was poor but Defoe had a great shot in the first half and that was it. His form is also dreadful. If we want to play 4-4-2 then we need 2 new strikers but Ade, Demspey and Defoe as reserves, or even better sell one of Defoe or Ade. Love Totty, taking off Lennon was simply because he did nothing, Walker wasn't really exposed as the ball was generally in their half, they parked the bus for Christ sake. We simply cannot break down a team that has everyone behind the ball. We a team sets up like that it is important to score early, which will make them come out and attack. QPR nicked 3 points off of Chelsea and 1 from us by setting up not to lose and take your chances if you get one. Man Utd will come onto us which in turn will allow us to attack against less men.
yiddyboy
Does anyone know if Ade's gets paid by THFC while he swans of on holiday for maybe six weeks.
Yido T
I get the feeling Remy was a player Harry wanted. He's tried to sign him for QPR & if he was one of our main targets we'd be in there by now. If we go in late I get the feeling it'll be more a case of not wanting to let a possible bargain slip by rather than having any real interest.

Ade & Defoe seem to get in each others way when they play up top together & both seem to relish the space they get when played alone. It's also notable how much their work rate improves when they play as a lone striker. I'd go one up front with the other used to change the game from the bench, at least that way AVB has a potential game changing sub at his disposal.
Spurs Allday
Javier Pastore Anyone? Done sweet FA at PSG and apparentley he and the club have had numerous fall outs. They paid £32m for him but honestley could ask fot that as his stock has fallen since 2011 even tho he is still only 23. He could be our David Silva if we got him performing. Stick a bid in and see what happens.
hudderspur
for me the problem will always be defoe. he is too selfish, doesn't gel with anyone and doesn't anticipate crosses. he scores in batches, and his chance conversion rate is very poor, 1 goal per 9 shots so far this season. we are accommodating him and everyone else suffers. people go on about adebayors attitude but defoe actually causes a much bigger fuss when he is dropped. ade wants to be number 1, thats what he was last season and that is what he expected when he came back. his attitude is nothing to do with finally getting a contract IMO but rather to being second choice. I would love to see how we play without defoe with either dempsey or siggy partnering adebayor. I prefer AVB to harry in almost every respect, except in the question of defoe
Guernman
hudderspur I noticed Lloris kicking off a couple of times, especially with poor passing decisions. Like you say he's a winner.
Spurs Allday
OX, "you have to assume that we dont fancy Remy...". Good point. IMO he knows whom he wants in this window and things are in motion to make it happen. What many are not realising is that this is the FIRST proper window of AVB's tenure. He is now under REAL test and it would be interesting to see whom he has in mind. Remy was linked to us constantly under Harry, but seems we (AVB) were just not interested in him this time round. AVB would've had a long hard look at our squad and I am convinced he has earmarked new additions. However, I wouldn't be surprised if Levy is being Levy and not making things happen in a timely fashion. If no one is signed by the end of the window, then I would be truly disappointed and wondering about our ambitions this season. It'd be a shame to come this far (4th) and potentially give no support to your manager. COYS!
Critical_Spur
Amen Guernman
yiddyboy
I'd sell Defoe now whilst top dollar can be gained £8m-£10m? Buy a goal poacher, someone like Hernandez. In the summer sell Ade and spend £20-£25m on a top striker as long as CL football is achieved
yiddyboy
I don't know why so many seem to think Defoe is so great, he may love the Spurs but so did/do O'Hara and Dawson. But they are also not world beaters.
yiddyboy
With Sneijder stalling on a move(he's said he's happy to wait til deadline day) that we'll make a last gasp move for him. Leave it til Inter are desperate & then do a deal on Levy's terms. It's how he works & It seems clear that Sneijder wants a PL move.
Spurs Allday
And as for Dawson, he made 1 great cross field pass to Bale and then everything else ended up in the stands. I'm thinking he's a spot betting man and likes to bet on the number of throw-ins.
yiddyboy
Itís hardly a holiday is it? He is traveling to play as their captain. Both Ade and Defoe didn't exactly have their best games. Losing one of them isnít a blessing thou, because we could be short. 3 forwards are better than 2. Just because one of our guys hasnít found the net in a few games, doesnít mean he wonít pop up and have a scorcher in the next. Against QPR Defoe had that one clear shot that Cesar brilliantly saved, Ade bounded in, around their defender and Cesar again got down to it. I'm sure that would have changed the game had either shot gone in. Both can produce and play with fire so we need to get behind the lads as their form needs to return and quick. Credit to rangers thou, they were setup well with 2-3 players around our attackers all the time. Big game next week and we can expect more of the same from their defenders. I guess we will go for a fill in option while Adeís away...if at allÖ.Iím hearing we went in for Remy again but heís probably off to Newcastle after all. Summer is the best time imo as we will have more options to pick from. Lot of guys here have been saying the same all along. Focus should be on a creative midfielder. COYS.
SpursOne2
I'm not at all disappointed we didn't sign Remy. But it doesn't take much to realize that we have a problem at the front line (or we have an absence of a front line). I wrote in the summer before Adebayor was signed that I wasn't enthused, given his history of alienation from previous teams and his regression of form after his one good year with each of his previous clubs, but last year he was winning me over. This year, my fears seem to have been realized. I cannot take much credit for this insight, as the whole world saw this coming to one extent of another. But even so, Adebayor has a lot to do to convince us now that his signing wasn't a large mistake. I'm of the belief that the lad has the requisite talent, but he's a complicated man with many psychological distractions. Something about him that I like, but he's certainly a frustration to have on our squad. Maybe a trip to the home continent can help to bring him some peace of mind and he can return a bit recharged.
Total knobhead
Second to RamsesV on the frustration with Dawson knocking these aimless long balls that tend merely to turn the ball over to the other team. I understand why AVB was ready to sell his contract at the beginning of the season. Daws has so many good aspects, but surely the lad can be taught to stop these aimless long balls. It's completely antithetical to everything else AVB is trying to instill in the team. Enough Daws. Stop this now if you want to save your career at N17.
Total knobhead
"Does anyone know if Ade's gets paid by THFC while he swans of on holiday for maybe six weeks," Yido T.

of course he does.

Total knobhead
hudderspur,Lloris was def not happy with the lack of winning mentality with some players and was spot on.him and sandro seemed to be the only two in the team.sad but shows up most weeks.
bazdog
Totally agree with spursallday,Ade & Defoe work better up front alone than with each other.I've thought for some time that the best combination is either one up front with Demsey providing the movement behind & supplying the clever through balls that his intelligence can spot.I don't think there is anyone else in the squad as creative in that hole behind the front man that Dempsey fills.
Greavesaboveall
Ade is a one goal in 4 good chances man, so his lack of goals are no real surprise to me this season. Last season we used to create many more chances for him,mayb that was down to VdVs and his qualities?? So I wouldn't say it is down to his attitude, more down to his woeful finishing of some real pi** easy chances!!
WestStandEnclosure
Sandro to play on Sunday according to some reports on line? Did AVB really say this? Any official word on Sandro's condition? We're certainly a weaker team without him.
Total knobhead
On reflection I really should have checked that last sentence before I put it out!
Greavesaboveall
At the moment playing a 4-4-1-1 with Dempsey looks a better bet than 4-4-2 with Adebeyor. I've got more cofidence in Dempsey to get goals. For a few seasons now we have had problems with strikers, back to when we lost the Berbatov/Keane partnership really. To my mind what we need is a Dzeko type centre forward, someone who may not be the prettiest but consistently gives the central defenders problems and gets goals. Physically there's no reason Adebeyor couldn't do that, but it just doesn't seem to be in him. We've made up for the lack of goals up front by healthy contributions from midfield, what worries me is what happens when Bale finally leaves. Having said all that strikers are expensive, AVB had better get the signing right. If he's not confident in the player then don't sign him. We were apparantly looking at Michu at one point but passed on him. If we'd made that signing we wouldn't be having this discussion.
jod
Greaves...LOL!...but those holes need filling, with a big boot up the backside!
Critical_Spur
Anyone who voted to get Adebayor 1% of the MOTM tally must surely be taking the pi$$!! I said on a thread on Friday that I believed from day one that he was a big mistake on a permanent transfer, and week in week out I'm sorry to say I was bang on the money. Anyone, and I mean ANYONE would be an improvement on him. Take your pick from Moussa Sow, Doumbia, Lamella, Lewandowski, the usual suspects (Damiao/Negredo etc.....) but please GOD give us a fighting chance of at least hanging onto our position. We phucked up royally this time last year by not strengthening and it cost us massively, and we CAN'T let it happen again. Goals win games, and at the moment if our midfielders don't score then neither do we. Come what may, in the summer I want rid of Adebayor, Defoe, and probably Dempsey. We need strikers who we can rely on to score consistently, especially given the likely departure of Bale to our 'partners' in Spain. Come on you beautiful Spurs!!!
LilyWhiteHart
jod I think that a Dzeko type is what AVB is looking at as we're constantly linked with Damiao & Negredo who are both big, physical strikers. Hopefully they're better finishers than Dzeko too, it's what lets him down. Sometimes in that final moment he just seems to get over excited & doesn't set himself properly.
Spurs Allday
Good article Ox, but with respect it all but misses the point. Rather than "make do and mend"by fidddling with formations, and playing square pegs in round holes whilst Adebayor is absent, the real answer is to go out and buy a decent striker, who, might, with the chances we make, crosses that go in, score as many or more than Defoe an Adebayor do put together. We missed an opportunity to get in for Demba Ba before Chelsea did, possibly with Sturridge, but not in my opinion with Remy. At the moment Spain is on it's arse, some of the clubs are insolvent, there must be opportunities there if you are brave enough, determined enough, and realistic about offers, and the value of players. The guy Negredo from Seville, one of the clubs that are skint, would seem ideal, his goal/game ratio is far better than what we have, both for his club and country, £12-15M would probably get him. We should undoubtedly take the opportunity in this window to bring a striker in. Even when he is here, Adebayor is hardly worth his place these days, and the goals yield from him and Defoe is just not good enough, neither is their combined chance conversion rate. We are a Jaguar team, trying to get by with a Ford Ka strike force. I am afraid we are stuck with Adebayor due to his massive wages subsidy from Man City for 2 years of his 3 year deal, if that is not transferable, who is going to take him on £175k/Wk, so we may have to live with him as a bench warmer, if we sign better, which we must do if we seriously want to finish in the top 4, and have CL football next season. Saturday's game at QPR was a prime example of what happens if you miss scarce chances, and have 7 shots on target failing to score, 2 points thrown away exactly the same as v WBA, Norwich, and Stoke at home, it simply is not good enough. The remedy is so obvious.
Frank
Can anyone clarify the situation with Bentley's contract? Has he got 18 months to run or is it 6 months with us having an option to extend it by a further year? Just reports are suggesting he's out of contract but when we signed him I'm sure it was a 6 year deal. If he's out then fantastic! Him, Jenas & Gomes off the wage bill in 6 months.
Spurs Allday
Willian & Negredo would make bus parking a thing of the past. With Willian's dribbling ability he'd just dance past them, or at least get tripped to earn us a dangerous free kick. Plus he's Brazilian so he can probably take them as well! Negredo would give us that sledgehammer that we lack. Power & strength, park that bus all you want a big strong bully up top would smash through it, like Drogba would.
Spurs Allday
Spurs Allday- I thought he still had 18mths to go but I have seen a few articles and posts mentioning he'll be gone in the summer, I too would like confirmation?
shedboy2
shedboy2 I've just read the BBC article when we signed him & it states that he has a contract "up to six years" which may suggest that it is 5 with an option of a sixth. I'm sure Berbatov was on a 4 year deal with an option to extend by a further 2 so it wouldn't be the first time we've used this method.
Spurs Allday
Spurs Allday, I think we are stuck with him until he is ready for the old folks home. Who in their right mind would want him, let alone what Levy might be asking for him! Despite not making a needy signing so far, I am amazed at the lack of news regarding departures.
Critical_Spur
Spurs Allday, I think you will find that Bentley was on a 5 year deal, with an additional 1 year option. I can't remember when he came (it seems about 10 years ago) but his deal can't have long to run, along with Jenas, and Coco the clown, as you say.
Frank
Looks to me as if the jury is out on the performances of Ade to date, his not looked the same player, on loan he played as the loan striker with VDV behind him, Defoe was then most used as a sub. His had the time required to gain his fitness, he has good movement but not enough of it and at times looks as if he would rather be some were else. Well over the next few weeks he will be, so we go back to how we started the season without him, Defoe on his own again supported by Dempsey (who was unlucky not to start on saturday) we know the next game is going to be a hard one, but they did the job away, we will get chances next week, lets hope we don't headline ''spurs missed Adebayor'' but then what if he gets injured in the ACON? We have a top striker in Defoe, but another would not go a miss.
spu 4 life
ghulamville Llorente would be perfect for us. Whats happened with his move to Juve? It seemed like it was just a case of signing a contract but it's gone very quiet & Juve are being linked with every other striker on the market?? Maybe a chance to strike, but I'm not getting my hopes up. We do need that type of striker though. A strong, areial type like Dzeko, Llorente, Damiao, Negredo etc
Spurs Allday
Press saying Blackburn are interested in Bentley. Judging by their antics since the Venk's arrival, they just might be daft enough.
Frank
Thanks Frank. Lets hope we can, at the very least, get them out on loan to ease the wage bill.
Spurs Allday
United could be without Young & Vidic, both got knocks during the Liverpool game & United also have West Ham in the cup this week so lets hope hope they lose a couple more or at least suffer fatigue.
Spurs Allday
The rumour mill has been very quiet for us in this window. Could it be that Levy is doing some behind the scenes huh hush negotiations. I think not. I just don't think we are signin anyone. As peterbalb has been saying in previos posts, the value of the club is rocketing so why would ENIC/Levy risk £20 - £30m on when they don't need to!!
jonathan01
Spurs 4 life, I don't think the jury is out on Adebayor's form this season, he has simply been poor. He looks de-motivated, disinterested, listless, and as if he wants to be elsewhere. He has been a one season wonder everywhere he has been in England, looks as though we are no different.
Frank
Juve have stated no signigns in Jan, so either its BS or we could steal Llorente.
hudderspur
Poor old Ade looks like he more likely to fall over his own feet at the moment than score. We do need another striker (and a bit more creativity in the middle)
SPUDMAN
Spurs Allday - Thing is the physique is only part of it, Adebeyor has that. You need the mental toughness and determination too. The problem with any overseas striker is you don't know whether or not he can do it in the premier league until after you sign him.
jod
Gomez is in Brazil to possibly finalise a move back to Brazil apparently as makeweight to a striker deal
ItalianYiddo
Not sure which is worse, watching saturday dire game, or having to read the same ole posts about how poor are strikers are in every article since saturday.......
Ossie
Frank - in response, i don't like to pick on players, they are playing for our team, some have limited ability to us, but are professional footballers and we all know that if we had that ability and was playing for spurs we would walk off that pitch cream crackered every week, our love for the club is 110%. The question we have to ask is if we can see his a lost leader, then surely AVB does, the next step is what to do about it? As supporters every post mentions ''A new Striker'' so how many transfer windows does it take for us to go an buy one, we are still waiting, some buys work out some don't, we will never find another Jimmy Greaves, Chivers who did come good, Gilzean, Smith, Lineker, Crooks and Archibald, but we will find lots of Pav's and Redrov's if we are not careful. You have seen some great players, same as me since 1959, I don't know how long you started watching them, the younger guys want success on here, well so do i and if it means spending a few bob, Levy should go and do it. otherwise we might just fade away. I hope not.
spu 4 life
Jod I totally agree. Whoever it is has to have that aggressive side to him. We need a big guy who's not afraid to give defenders as good as he gets. Adebayor rarely went up for an aerial challenge with Hill & Nelson. We need a guy who's not scared of the rough stuff. No point in being a big strong CF if they act like a big wuss.
Spurs Allday
Gomez is in Brazil !!! he was told to go home and find another club, weeks ago.
spu 4 life
Ossie, fair point, but how many windows are we going to go through until it is resolved. I think you will find its been brought up in every article since berba left, not just since saturday. I hate to say this but i was right about defoe. Looks like this is gonna be yet another inconsistant season for him. same every year!
hudderspur
Yes, we need a striker, pronto! Top targets must be Damiao/Llorente, but I really really would like Levy to buy the most promising young swedish striker I've seen since Henrik Larsson - John Guidetti. Perhaps that's a better fit for our team since we got two senior strikers on the books already, both expecting to start - Ade's coming back... But for John it still would be an improvement with only two players ahead of him in his position instead of all the stars he's competing against i City?
spurswede
I've said it before and I'mk going to say it again. Juve want Llorente but can't afford him or his saary with their current squad. If we went to them with a sensible offer (£20m) for both Vucinic and Vidal together they woud seriously consider it. It would give us a Berbatov type striker in Vucinic (not the most prolific at the moment but he can be and always has been when in the right team) and a hard running, forward thinking, strong but tricky creative midfielder in Vidal. They already work well together and would help each other settle. It would be a cheap and eminently sensible solution to our current problems.
SpuriousLife
I've said it tie and time again Dawson is hopelessly slow, constantly caught out positionaly and destroys the way the team plays with that god damn useless, posession wasting, glory seeking diagonal ball.
spurticus87
Remy doesn't look that good this season. 1 goal in 14 league games and 2 in Europe. Not saying he's not talented, but he's obviously struggling.
SamParadise
Defoe is scoring below his career average in goals per 90 minutes. Just under .5 goals per 90 minutes as opposed to his career .6/90 minutes. Glad to see that so many think he's going to "regain" his form which will likely bring him back to his career averages. Is that enough? .6 goals per 90 minutes, scoring in bunches (facts is facts 14 goals in 29 Spurs appearances - 9 from 4 games 5 from 24 others). Or you could say he has scored in 9 of 29) while Bale, who has 11 for Spurs in 25 appearances has scored in 9 of 25. He's a winger though, and not a striker.

What is missed here, IMO, is the effect of Defoe on everyone around him. Dempsey, Adebayor and Bale have all seen their assist totals plummit. this season. Defoe has been on the pitch for over 1800 minutes of the approximately 2000 minutes we have played in the Premiership. Lennon, who everyone will agree is much improved has managed 3 goals and 5 assists in 22 appearances. Last season he scored 3 and assisted on 5 in 23 appearances. I'll bet he has played more minutes this season than last. Defoe is the up top man, whether in a 4-4-2 or a 4-5-1. There have been tons of crosses. After ten games Lennon and Bale were both in the top three of chances created in the league. Defoe, IMO, takes away from everyone else around him. He may well get his 18 goals, but Dempsey, Adebayor and other will all see last year's numbers drop. At the current rate, we can expect 8 more goals from Defoe if he plays every minute. If he gets back "on form" perhaps 9. Harry got it right. He is an impact sub. He should be nowhere near the startiing lineup. COYS
peterballb
Spurswede, agree wholeheartedly. Guidetti would be a good buy. 7M should do it. Add him, Son and Benat (30-35M) and we'd be flying. Something needs to be done and soon. Negredo and Benat (30M). There are lots of options out there. COYS
peterballb
My understanding is that Bentley and Gomes have 18 months left and Jenas is up in the summer. Jenas is in the States having surgery on his Achilles and Gomes is in Brazil trying to find a job back home which was his intended destination at the end of his contract anyway. None of them are part of the 25, so other than money, it is irrelevant. Best we can hope is to loan out Bentley and have Gomes find a team in Brazil that will take him. It will ot effect who we can register. COYS
peterballb
Pretty sure Llorente, his agent and the Bilbao President have all said, he will be there until the end of the year. My understanding is that Llorente is waiting to see if either RM or Barca want to consider him when he is free. If not, he will consider other options. COYS
peterballb
There are indeed lots of options but is there any real evidence that AVB/Levy share the view that there is a pressing need for another forward? They may well be taking the view that although Ade/Defoe have only contributed 12 EPL goals, the team itself has scored 39, and prior to Saturday that was as many as we had scored at the same point after 21 games last season Ė which, of course, included the incredible winning run before Christmas, 3rd position in the table and accolades all round for our creative and attacking football.
GARYKIR
I watched the Arsenal vs City game, and to be honest I wasn't overly impressed by Dzeko. He didn't look any better than Ade, and apart from his tap in and a decent pass to Tevez, he didn't do much. Didn't hold up play and his touch wasn't great. Now David Silva, there's a player that would slot perfectly into our team, I almost prefer him to Modric.
Fanman
David Silva's goal rate is quite poor for an AM, but because he is surrounded by goal scorers at Citeh. It's not that much of an issue for them, but it would be a problem for us, we'd need him to contribute goals.
Guyver
Team balance is key imo.
Guyver
Fanman............it's a little unfair to say Dzeko didn't do anything apart from his tap-in, he won them a penalty and got a defender sent off, ok he missed the penalty but as we know from our game at the library once you go down to 10 against a top team you haven't got a lot of hope. When did you last see Defoe particularly, and Ade to a lesser degree, cause that much trouble to central defenders!
TQ2Spurs
peterballb, I don't think we need to buy more than one promising young striker - since we got Kane, Coulibaly - so it would either be Son or John and I'd go for John 'cause I've seen quite a lot of him over the years and his learning curve is going upwards quite sharp. he's also very determined and has got a level-headedness I like and a strong belief in himself. I also think he's ready for the premierleague and could make an impact from the start, and that Ade's gone for a few weeks woulkd make him interrested I think because it almost certainly guarantees him game-time. I don't think we need any more midfielders, except for a winger, so no benat...
spurswede
It seems to me that our problems steam from Ade and Defoe being played together rather then being used as cover for each other. Dempsey and Siggy should be competing for the role Ade currently fills. Defoe and Ade together just hasn't worked. Our 4-4-2 / 4-4-1 formation has solved our defensive problems but at the expense of any attacking threat. You have to look at the squad that AVB inherited and its obvious that there are real problems in certain areas, whether we limp on to the end of the season before we address these or risk a big money transfer try and shore up the league position is where AVB will sink or swim!
Slurms McKenzie
In case anyone is confused where our obvious flaws lie - its in the final third! I don't think we need just a new striker! RVP would struggle in our current set-up! We need a player who can lead the line on their own and also compliment either Defoe and Ade. This player needs to be available at reasonible money and thats includes wages. Much as I'd like o play fantasy fooball with Daniel Levy's / Enic's/ Joe Lewis's money these are the factors that we should consider before we select the next Berbatov or Rasiak!
Slurms McKenzie
Frank,love your assesment of the strike force or lac of.ford ka is a classic!
Little spur
Ghulamville, the reason Rodgers doesn't want Carroll is that like us he wants to play football properly. Carroll has neither the vision or footballing ability to do that, he is a lump, a big guy that has a bit of pace, can head it, and scrap and harass a bit. If he could afford him, his ideal club, and manager, would be Stoke City and Tony Pullis.
Frank
TQ2Spurs, Dzeko didn't do much to 'earn' the penalty. Kosceilny just hauled him to the ground. Apart from that, what did he contribute to the game? Also, by your reasoning, its "unfair" to criticise Dzeko, but ok to criticise our own players?
Fanman
Guyver, personally, I wouldn't be too concerned with how many goals David Silva scored. He's a playmaker who can operate in deep midfield or behind the striker. What's important is that he can unlock defences and provide assists. That is what we need most of all now. He unlocked the Arsenal defence a few times yesterday. We have Bale, Lennon, Dempsey, Ade and Defoe (let's be honest) who are all capable of scoring. A David Silva type would suit us perfectly in my opinion.
Fanman
Fanman, most of the posts on here either directly orindirectly infer criticism of one or more of our players, it is inevitable when offering and opinion on a match where all or some of our players were below par. When did Defoe last win us a penalty? I appreciate you are somewhat reliant on a referee to see and then give it but the chances are greatly increased if you are actually causing problems for the defenders which I rarely see from him, maybe thats because he is so short and is not seen as a threat on high crosses and corners.
TQ2Spurs
Spurswede, I would submit a young strikr is not enough. We need wing cover and we absolutely need a string puller in the final third.

Slurms, Berba, Bent, Kenae, Crouch, Pav, VDV, Ade, Mido et all have not worked well with Defoe. Nothing I have seen of Defoe on the pitch with Dempsey or Sigurdsson tells me it'll be anything different. While I believe there is enough talent for Ade and Dempsey to work, Ade is completely out of form and gone for at least a few more weeks (assuming no injury). Defoe is a lone striker. He plays. If he's banging them in, it's great. If not, he is detrimental to everyone around him. We need a real, up top lone striker (Negredo would be good, Leandro better long term) and Benat as the string-puller and Son as the wing/AMF cover. Defoe and Dempsey do not make good outlet men so they can't really be the lone striker. Dempsey up top of Adebayor, I believe will work, but it's yet to be tried and the time is nigh to resolve the issue. I agree, RVP alone would not solve the issues, though he would represent a threat up the middle which might provide a little more space to the wingers. He is also far more likely to get on the end of the crosses. Did Defoe do anything in the match the other day after Cesar saved his shot. He was a terrible. Ran around. Passed the ball back from whence it came. Just as bad as the Villa game, only difference was that he scored in that one. He was completely pants otherwise. COYS
peterballb
When a team parks the bus we dominate the possession but don't really create too many clear cut chances. This is where the strikers require quality service, in Sandro/Parker/Dembele none are really in the mould of a Sneijder/Moutinho/Silva sort of player. Our 3 are all strong and good at keeping possession albeit not really doing too much with it. This is a clear area that needs addressing along with a top striker that maybe Defoe and Ade can still learn from. Although on this front I don't hold my breath.
yiddyboy
TQ2Spurs, Defoe cannot win penalties as he really does little to take guys on. His runs are generally behind much taller defenders. Since you mention it, can you recall the last time he earned a penalty? You also tend not to earn many penalties when you always give up on plays. When he shoots and it is saved, blocked or goes off the woodwork, his hands inevitably go to his head, rather than playing to the whistle. It's why he also rarely pounces on his own rebounds. COYS
peterballb
yiddyboy, how many times Saturday were you screaming for someone to hit Defoe or Adebayor on a run? I can't recall one where I said, if only it had been slotted through it was a golen opportunity. Not once. Nothing, up top, is in sync. It's the strikers. There have been loads of opportunities. Lots of crosses. Just no one there. COYS
peterballb
Yiddyboy.........I think it's difficult for our two central midfielders to be creative when we are playing a 442 formation because they are invariably outnumbered in that area unless we are playing another team playing the same formation which is rare now. I feel AVB is only playing this way because of the players available to him at the moment, Defoe and Lennon (and Bale to a degree) being unsuitable for 433/451, I think the former two will be either sold or kept as impact subs once AVB is able to bring in his preferred players.
TQ2Spurs
No Peter, I can't remember the last time! :-)
TQ2Spurs
Montpellier president Louis Nicollin has told reporters that a bid of around £12m would be enough to see Belhanda leave the Ligue 1 side in January. Tottenham have been heavily linked to French-born Morocco midfielder Belhanda, who began his career in a deep lying midfield role, but has flourished since moving further forward where his vision and technique were vital to Montpellier's title winning season in 2012. His experience may be crucial to a Champions League push. Now that Shakhtar have captured Taison, Tottenham and his other Premier League admirers will have been filled with renewed hope that they can finally land the Ukraine side's creative hub, Willian. With 18 months left on his contract, Willian is likely to fulfil his dream and play in the Premier League and would be a huge asset to any club willing to stump up the cash. Forget Damiao for another six months and keep in mind Jermain Defoe is Tottenham's only senior striker now Adebayor is on Togo duty, the club have turned their attention to Negredo. Sevilla president Jose Maria del Nido recently flew to London with the purpose of the visit rumoured to be to sort a deal with Spurs for the sale of Negredo, who reckons his style is suited to the Premier League. Galatasaray are supposedly close to signing the unsettled Inter midfielder and are reported to have made him a lucrative offer to move to Turkey. However, the Dutch ace is keen on a Premier League transfer and is not short on suitors with Spurs, Chelsea and Man United all keen on him, but not on his incredibly high wages. Like we've said, though, there is still time before the transfer window closes, particularly where Daniel Levy is concerned.
spu 4 life
I agree Fanman, Silva has many skills that would add a lot to the current Spurs side, but by playing him in his favoured AM position, Dempsey (a goal scorer) is on the bench, Lennon averages 3 goals a season, Parker/Sandro and Dembele arent prolific. I don't think the extra chances Silva create's, would compensate for his own lack of goals, we'd need to bring in a consistent goal scorer like Aguero to enable supporters to overlook Silva's mediocre finishing.
Guyver
That's the latest on players we won't sign Belhanda, Negredo, Willian and Sneijder
spu 4 life
Or in dream world, Negredo could have started leaving out Ade, Belhanda on for the injured Sandro Willian on for Lennon, Sneijder on for Dembele, wonder if we have un-locked them then after 60mins? Fair play rules, no spurs rule.
spu 4 life
Like your thinking Spu! :-)
TQ2Spurs
topho against the tactic's QPR used i'd agree Bale play's at his best on the left, with Lennon on the right but occasionally swapping wing's has it's advantages. TBH against QPR, our wingers couldnt get into the game whether they were on the left or the right, so I didnt see that as the biggest problem. Our problem was that we looked like Stoke "trying" to play good football and failing miserably. It was boring to watch us moving the ball around at snail pace, with next to no movement. No chance of dragging opposition defenders out of position playing like that.
Guyver
Peter I agree with you and I'm no flag waver for Defoe but it is clear that on his own in front of a five man midfield he is far more effective then in front of Ade with Lennon and Ball attacking out wide but further back down the pitch. Ade and Defoe cannot play together no more then any of the other players you have listed could play with him. His best partner was Crouch (who is probably the least mobile and generally knocked it down for him to run onto or laid it back to Defoe to score) who probably played ahead of defoe on the pitch! But Rotating Ade and Defoe would have made more sense then trying to shoe horn them onto the pitch together. Maybe we could put this down to AVB making sure they didn't work together, in that case we could call it mission accomplished!
Slurms McKenzie
hudderspur - Interesting what you saw re Parker and Lloris. To be fair to Parker his style of play is less attacking to Sandro but is a slightly different player and what he does he does well which is similar to Dawson. They both throw their bodies on the line and Parker is known for his work rate but he doesn't have an attacking mind. This can be useful and that was seen last season especially ithe first half of the season. he hasn't had time to adjust to Lloris but I take your point Lloris is a international GK that plays to win.

I agree with all your comments on players such as Dembele and Ade. I think Dembele is over rated any way and I have never been convinced him, Dempsey are good enough if we want to become regular CL club for me they are good but not good enough, not the class of VDV or Modric. regardless of these players weaknesses.

As for Ade never wanted him too much trouble and will cause problems wherever he goes.

Critical_Spur - AVB interviewed again and said not looking to bring in a striker we are happy with Dempsey and Defoe and we will not lose Ade for many games. he stressed Defoe and Dempsey had a successful partnership before. I really wonder if he has any plans to bring in any one this January whether that is down to him or Levy no idea.

Yiddy - re Dawson I think Dawson had improved when he got back into the side and he didn't do so many long balls but that part of this game is creeping back in and I wonder whether it is again panic because we are not scoring and he is trying to push it and get the ball up top as soon as possible. Sometimes we just don't know what goes of in players minds.
thfan
Thfan knocking the ball around on the ground wasn't working against QPR, there was no pace or speed to the passing so maybe a long ball over the top might have worked better? Was this Dawsons thinking? When it works its a majestic sight a raking cross field ball to the toe of Gareth Bale whos in full flight! Unfortunately most of the time he'd have to take flight to control Dawsons passes!
Slurms McKenzie
A young lad at school today spoke of his excitement, telling his fellow class mates and teacher, that sitting in row A of the lower stand and seeing Gareth Bale close up was really really good, ''it's my fourth game and i have never had so much of the ball land on me, Micheal Dawson picked me out ever time''
spu 4 life
Schneijder wants 160k net/week. Not gonna happen, at least not at Spurs. Belhanda is affordable and available. , Negredo is affordable and available. Willian is still in the CL. Why would he leave? Summer, sure. Son is available and affordable. Guidetti is available. Benat, for the right price, would probably be available. Moutinho, IMO is way too expensive (26M GBP - too much). Sissokho could be done on a free pre-contract. Lots of guys out there. Not all at astronomical prices. Mitroglou (3M Euros), Castaignos (5M Euros), Guidetti (7M GBP), Son 12M Euros. Add Sissokho for free and Belhande for 12M and you have re-made the strike force and added wing cover and a string puller for 35M or so. Sell Rose and Hudd to recoup some of the funds. Wait until the summer and move the players that no longer fit. Probable loss this year and a profit next year as there will be players like Defoe, Dempsey, Sigurdsson, Livermore, Parker on the block in the summer. I suspect we can't move Adebayor for another year. Jenas comes off in the summer. Gomes hopefully finds a suitor in Brazil and hopefully Blackburn loan Bentley. In an ideal world I'd loveus to get Negredo, Son and Benat and sign Sissokho on a pre-contract. 40M tops. COYS
peterballb
Adebayor is good player so why knock him. Is it his turn? It is difficult to link up with Defoe who is a one dimensioal player. two steps and wallop the ball anywhere! Dembele was obviously not fit on Saturday but did his best. Is he carrying a long term injury?
camper
Slurms, I don't agree with Defoe up top. He was not effective up top of VDV, when it was used. He couldn't play with Berba. He and Bent tripped over themselves. The Crouch to Defoe thing worked at Pompey, but never did at Spurs. The year of his 18 goals he scored 5 against Wigan, 3 against Hull and had 2 goals in all the other games up to November 22, all playing alongside Keane, with whom he had no chemistry. He and Dempsey have looked terrible with no one to hold the ball up and distribute out wide. He'll score his goals. he'll turn and fire. Some will go in. More will be wasted. I don't understand why everyone believes it will be different. He has been the same player (rather consistent, it should be noted) for over a decade. It's what he is. COYS
peterballb
4-2-3-1 is the way to go... 4-4-1-1 in effect... but it suits our way of playing 3 attacking midfielders of Bale, Lennon and ??????????... behind a lone striker like ???????????????..

i leave those 2 positions unknown because we dont have those 2 players yet...

the one good thing that came out of the QPR match was the fact we had Parker to come on for the injured Sandro. Which actually showed we had serious depth to our squad in that specific position..
and apart from us being quite well covered in most defensive positions.

We dont have REAL strength in the 2 positions that are crucial to us...

Central Attacking Midfielder... and Striker... NEEDED NOW..


.....................New Striker/Defoe/Ade.............................

..........Willian/Isco/Benat/Sneijder/Balhanda/Holtby..........

....Bale/SIggy.......................................Lennon/Dempsey

............Dembele/Verts..................Sandro/Parker...........

BAE/Naugt....Verts/Caulker....Kaboul/Daws...Walker/Naugh

.............................Lloris/Friedel.......................................
Yidmarks
topho, being a former manager of Porto, AVB is use to teams parking the bus against his sides. At Porto he only used inverted wingers and was successful with it, and inverted wingers havent been a problem for other top sides across europe like Bayern (who also use a right footed LB in Lahm), Barca and Mourinho's Chelsea/Madrid. Not saying that's the best method for us, but clearly it's a style that many top managers have used to combat the bus parkers.
Guyver
This is what Danny Boy lives for. All the speculation all the intrigue all the mystery... Who, what and when is the little loser going to buy???
pelebro
My point topho, was that inverted wingers were not a hindrance in dealing with bus parkers, if it was, top sides who come up against this tactic more than most, wouldnt use inverted wingers at all..
Guyver
If you sat down and had a conversation with Mourinho and Guardiola, advising them not to use inverted wingers against bus parkers, they'd probably LOL.
Guyver
You don't agree with me and many top successful managers in the world, im ok with that..
Guyver
From now until the end of january, i am going to try really hard when i post, not to mention anymore on the transfer front. I urge you all to try the same. :-)
spu 4 life
Topho, You are claiming that orthodox wingers are the best way to beat bus parkers, so why would top clubs and top managers handicap themselves by specifically signing guys like Ribery and Robben and playing them as inverted wingers against bus parkers? That doesnt make sense. Arshavin, Gervino, Henry, Ribery, Robben, Duff, Marin, Hazard, Sturridge, Ronaldo, Di Maria, Messi, (start of his career) Silva (Spain) Pedro, Nasri, Kalou ect ,ect, even Man Utd target Zaha is a right footed winger who like Ashley Young spends half his time on the left. How many inverted wingers employed by top clubs in the last 5 years do you need? Do you really need a media quote when the evidence is so obvious?
Guyver
Go watch a game and step out of the 90's for a minute, the evidence is there, if you're too blind to see it, I can't help you.
Guyver
IMO, it does not make a darn whether you use inverted wingers or conventional wingers if the players in the middle haven't a clue what to do with the balls thrown in. I prefer keeping players in position because Bale and BAE have an understanding that Lennon and BAE don't have. Corluka had that same understanding with lennon. It takes lots of time on the practice pitch but also in games tio develop that. I would prefer that the players worked on their shooting with their weak foot. Adebayor could have easily scored if he'd have taken his chance in the second half with his left foot. Instead he controlled to pull it on to the right and the chance was lost. FB's aren't stupid. If Bale's on his off wing, guess what he'll do? COYS
peterballb
Why don't you provide evidence to back up your claim? All you've done is provide opinions and baseless assertions, that contradict today's era where inverted wingers are becoming more and more common.
Guyver
Topho, you won't be able to find me a quote from any manager stating that playing a lone forward formation, is a bad way of breaking down a parked bus. But due to the fact we see so many top teams using lone forward formations against bus parkers, without any problems, it's reasonable to infer that lone forward formations are not necessarily detrimental to breaking down bus parking systems. To clarify, the FACT, in todays's game, we see so many teams using lone forward formations against VERY defensive sides, without encountering any problems, suggests lone forward formations are not handicapping teams playing against bus parking sides. Same logic can be used for inverted wingers. So it's not your opinion against mine, it's your opinion against the idea's of the the best tacticians in the game today. Orthodox wingers seem to be going the same way as the 4-4-2, for now.
Guyver
And i will "foff" not because you told me too, but because im tired, good night!
Guyver
A lot of teams play 4-3-3 where your top 3 should be moving about.In that case your overlapping players should be not be inverted (if that's the word) so as to provide balance to the team.Agree with Peter if you are playing wingers it doesn't really matter.However all wingers should be relatively proficient on their weaker foot.
matt hoten
topho, matt hoten and Peter are saying it generally doesnt matter whether wingers are inverted or not. You are saying quote, "that inveretd wingers are most likely to make it harder" So you're not agree with them really...
Guyver
Inverted wingers does stretch park the bus defenders.. , makes them play on the weaker side, makes space aswell. Loads of benefits really...i dont know why you would call AVB wrong for using this string to his bow? Some teams invert full backs to try and cope...some teams just don't have the depth which makes this way effective. The evidence is there if you watch teams. Pool were good at it so are united in the PL. We are as we have 2 decent wingers in Lennon and Bale. I don't think anyone is wrong in this argument, especially not AVB. COYS.
SpursOne2
Good point SpursOne2, some managers use right footed LB's to combat left footed right wingers. Bale and Lennon may be better played as conventional wingers, but I see no problem with AVB using variation at times.
Guyver
It hasnt worked too often to be fair, more to do with the players we have though, which is why I agree that in most cases Bale should stay left, Lennon right. The 3-1 victory against Fulham last season was a good example of Lennon & Bale switching wings and having an effect. 1 things for sure, Lennon has proved to be far more effective on the left, than Bale is on the right.
Guyver
topho Ė The evidence is there plain to see. Winger switch all the time to try and break a team down, which is why we are seeing more and more attaching full backs. Oh, and the reason we found ourselves having to try new angles under Harry is because our attacking force at the time was leaving team fully in their own half. Your pretty much saying, always stick to Bale left, Lennon right regardless? Teams learn, how many times do you hit the same wall expecting different results? Exactly, sometimes you have to work the play to open teams up. Which was my point? Itís having more strings to your bow. Weather you start in one formation, spot a change that can be effective and imply it during the game, doesn't matter. Anyway you asked for Evidence? Go back if you can and watch our game against Villa. We won 4-0 back in December. Prime examples were when their own central defender switch places to try and cope with Defoe. It backfired. Bale and Lennon were then able to create more holes by cutting inside, playing defenders on the wrong foot. They did switch a few times and created so many problems for them. They tried to deal with our tactics by swapping defenders, but it ended up with us responding positively (AVB tactics) and scoring again. I can go off now and find some more examples, hopefully some clips but more than likely match reports. Can you now provide me evidence that intact I am wrong, and that playing Bale Left, Lennon right is the way to stay? I wasnít trying to prove you or Guyver wrong by the way, your both correct in a sense. So is AVB though. COYS.
SpursOne2
But this blanket statement "inveretd wingers are most likely to make it harder" is still demonstrably false.
Guyver
Can't remember the 1st half against Fulham very well, but I do recall Fulham battering us once we took the lead. I think AVB is hoping Bale can add to his game and do what players like Ronaldo and Hulk do. When you think about it from that perspective, knowing what AVB has seen in his short management career, it makes sense why he would try Bale on the right from time to time.
Guyver
Of course itís relevant. This is the whole point. They made changes themselves, switching players at the BACK even after the amount of clear chances we had made. Also, Bale was able to play not only on the left (where you would keep him period) but the rightÖ allowing Lennon to switch and stretch players, and also in the MIDDLE. This gave us yet another dimension. Was AVB wrong to do that? (The score line will answer it). Making these types of decisions, can win matches right? Sometimes keeping it simple is the way to go. This is what the managerís job is, and to get it right depending on whom you are playing. And fortunately AVB has experience doing this, as have many other top managers which has already been pointed out. I think I understand the new coach a lot more now than when he first joined. Iím happy he is able to swap things around, Itís better amo to have than just staying with one formation. Iím surprised you donít agree.
SpursOne2
topho - I can say what I want and mate, all Iím trying to do IS ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS. I even provided you evidence which you discarded without even thinking about. 4-4-2 works against some teams and will get results (YES WHEN PARKING THE BUS). Swapping Bale and Lennon for extended periods WORKS in some games (WHEN PARKING THE BUS). Keeping Bale on the left and Lennon on the right WORKS in some games. I DON'T GET YOUR POINT then because AVB does all of this, he can squat and do nothing or make a change like the above. My general rule of thumb against teams Ďparking the busí, is to keep the right TEMPO and keep the crosses/ through balls coming and the opposition are bound to make a mistake. Sometime youíre at a stale mate and you have to make changes like this WHEN TEAMS ARE PARKING THE BUS. And no, we don't agree on the Villa game, I was there, imo major change in the game was us forcing a change at the back of their defense, due to them trying to deal with our attack. You donít like that one example thatís all do you? I could find another but i think it will be wasted...
SpursOne2
topho - Yes they did make changes to stop out attack...jesus i was there, i saw WITH MY OWN EYES, they tried to deal with Defoe by swapping their defenders. To stop our attack. All it mean was a quick shift from AVB's tactics and we get in.
SpursOne2
And to answer your other post topho - The Sunderland game.. We were 1 nil down (yes 4-4-2) and we can back to win. Both Lennon and Bale were there swapping sides if I remember correctly.. I think Bale came off later in the game... Do you want to narrow it down even further? Yes i remember last season. First we were screaming at Predictable Bale, then we all moaned when he mixed it up. At the end of the day, inverting wingers can work against these teams, sometimes not. Its better have the means under your belt than not. Can we agree on that? You keep making me go off to find evidence yet you watch games? Then watch some you will seeÖAll the teams players Guyver suggested, itís all there.
SpursOne2
topho - I understand perfectly fine? Your the one who has the problem with the facts not me. You keep tweeking your statement when it suits you. Come back again?
SpursOne2
 

Have Your Say

Log in...
with your social network     OR     with your Vital account

Recent Spurs Articles

What Should We Really Be Targeting? (Thursday October 30 2014)

Harry Edward Kane (Wednesday October 29 2014)

The Wrong Direction (Monday October 27 2014)

Tottenham Hotspur vs. Newcastle United (Saturday October 25 2014)

Thank You Erik (Saturday October 25 2014)

Tottenham Hotspur vs. Asteras Tripolis. (Thursday October 23 2014)

Are We There Yet? (Wednesday October 22 2014)

Manchester City vs. Tottenham Hotspur (Friday October 17 2014)

Veljković loan confirmed! (Thursday October 16 2014)

Archived Spurs Articles

List All Vital Spurs Articles
Have your say
Click here to suggest an article
Click here to suggest a poll

Vital Members League (view all)

1. Spurfect11 340
2. 80deg16minW 291
3. Spursex 272
4. Real Deal 262
5. MAN ON! 253
6. spurdon 252
7. Slurms McKenzie 198
8. Big Chiv 182
9. Kinygerbils 164
10. spursgirl_4_life 164

League Results (view all)

Latest Results
Spurs 1 - 2 Newcastle
Man City 4 - 1 Spurs
Spurs 1 - 0 Southampton
Arsenal 1 - 1 Spurs
Spurs 0 - 1 WBA
Sunderland 2 - 2 Spurs

League Table (view table)

Team P W D L GD Pts
8. Man Utd 9 3 4 2 3 13
9. Everton 9 3 3 3 2 12
10. Hull City 9 2 5 2 0 11
11. Spurs 9 3 2 4 -2 11
12. Stoke 9 3 2 4 -2 11
13. WBA 9 2 4 3 -1 10
14. Newcastle 9 2 4 3 -5 10

Breaking League News

Irvine Expecting Tough Leicester Encounter
Ľ WBA : 30/10/2014 17:12:00
Varela Resumes Full Training
Ľ WBA : 30/10/2014 17:07:00
Koeman Delighted With Second Stoke Win
Ľ Southampton : 30/10/2014 16:55:00
Sheffield United In The Quarter Finals
Ľ Southampton : 30/10/2014 16:48:00
Players Respond To Newcastle Loss
Ľ Man City : 30/10/2014 16:38:00

Current Site Poll (view all polls)

Your prediction for Spurs v Asteras?
Suggested By:  Vital Spurs
Spurs Win! 63%
Draw? 8%
Greek Tragedy! 29%