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Leeds United vs Tottenham Hotspur: FA Cup

Leeds and Tottenham as a fixture goes back to October 1924. We first met them in the FA Cup in 1954 when we drew 3-3 and got them back to Lane for a rematch and won 1-0. Over all our record with Leeds is pretty well even Games won 36 Games drawn 30 Games Lost 31.Cup history between the two clubs 1953/54 Leeds 3-3 Spurs 1953/54 Spurs 1-0 Leeds 1971/72 Leeds 2-1 Spurs 1981/82 Spurs 1-0 Leeds 1998/99 Leeds 1-1 Spurs 1998/99 Spurs 2-0 Leeds 2009/10 Spurs 2-2 Leeds 2009/10 Leeds 1-3 Spurs. In the last two most recent meetings Leeds have run us close in 1999 when we drew at Eland Road 1-1 and then beat them 2-0 at the Lane and again in 2010 when they gave us a hard time at Spurs and drew 2-2 only for us to go back to Eland road and eventually beat them 1-3.

The 2003-04 season saw Leeds United relegated from the Premier League after 14 years in the top flight, in the aftermath of the club's financial crisis. This came three years after reaching the Champions League semi-finals and they are still struggling to get the squad they need to get back to the top flight. Leeds currently sit in 11th place in the Championship. Their Average Goal tally is 1.39 per game and their home average is 1.43 and away 1.36. Luciano Becchio has scored 19 goals in 31 appearances this season. However, Becchio, who is their leading goal scorer, handed in a transfer request on Thursday after Leeds could not offer him the deal he was looking for to remain at the club and former loan player Alan Tate says he left Elland Road for what he described as 'the financial situation` at Leeds. Becchio for Spurs anyone?

It looks like this is the year for the Underdog and not many people will begrudge Bradford their day in the sun at Wembley against Swansea. But do Spurs need a good run in the cup? Let's face it the Trophy Cabinet is looking a bit bare nowadays with only a 2008 League Cup Victory to remember. We will not know what to expect from their contracted in player El Hadji Diouf who has played at more clubs than I have had hot dinners and depending on which Diouf turns up, on his day, he can be a handful. What we can confidently predict is a full house in their 37,900 all seater stadium! Their squad have some good players with big hearts and we can expect them to chase us down and chase our ball players.

They will probably try and crowd out Dembele and double up on Bale and Lennon. With the likes of Neil Kilkenny, Liam Fontaine, Ross McCormack and Ross Barkley they will not give us much time on the ball. Neil Warnock is no mug when it comes to setting his teams up either and we can probably expect him to take a leaf out of 'you know who' at QPR and crowd the midfield and close down the wings. So how will we set ourselves up against Leeds United? and what do you reckon the score will be? I think we'll win it and we could certainly do without a replay as that always causes a selection headache especially with two tricky away PL fixtures coming up against the Canaries and the Baggies.

Written by OyVeh Maria

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Writer: OyVeh Maria

Date:Friday January 25 2013

Time: 4:39PM

Your Comments

Expect them to park the bus and hit us on the break. It'll probably be 0-0 or won by a single scrappy or fluke goal - hopefully by us.

SpuriousLife

I do wonder if this is the game where we leave Defoe and Walker out.....they deserve that. And give Dempsey the main striker responsibility, put Naughton on RB and Let Beeny gain more match fitness. Also, Benny and Bale can start rebuilding their relationaship!!!

Critical_Spur

Must win to avoid replay and extra work for our lonely striker. Agree to rest Walker and Defoe. Play Dempsey and Obika.

Wilts Spurs

So probably looks like Defoe with Lennon and bale out wide, Coutinho, Dembele and Diame in midfield with BAE, Caulker, Dawson and Noughton with Friedel in goal.

Slurms McKenzie

Had all week to sort transfers with AVB. Now AVB must focus on beating Leeds and the away game with Norwich that we must win to keep on track in the league. Hope Levy has his list of players and sticks to it so in a weeks time we are buying new no.10 shirts with a decent name to go on the back.

Wilts Spurs

Only Joking AVB will probably want to give Diame and Coutinho a week or so to settle in!!!!!!

Slurms McKenzie

I think that we should rest Lennon, Defoe and Walker. Give Townsend, Siggy and Depsey a game. Play Dempsey up-front with Siggy behind him.

Fanman

Fanman, that would be my preferred inclusions. With Defoe, he may score a hatrick against Leeds and it goes to his head and back to earth thereafter. SO I'd much rather see what alternative options we have up front. IMO, Dempsey deserves a start with responsibility. I would prefer to see 2 up front. Perhaps Bale as 2nd striker?!

Critical_Spur

It's stating the obvious that it won't be easy. It's going to be graft, graft and then more graft. As for the team, Friedl is a no-brainer in goal. Walker needs a rest, so give the other Kyle a game at right back, with BAE coming in on the left. Caulker and Dawson for me at the back. Parker must start in midfield and I would give the HUdd a run out as well. Bale and Lennon on the wings for me, with Siggy behind Dempsey. The bench would therefore have Defoe, LLoris (or even Gomes???!), Walker, Vertonghen, Livermore, Townsend and Carroll on it. That's assuming we're allowed 7 subs. You could take away Livermore and put one of our young forwards - like Mason, or Obika, or even Coulthirst.

scoops50

must rest Defoe and Walker. They can't keep playing every game. Defoe on bench to practice his impact sub role. Also est Bale and give Townsend a run

Big Ron

Bale as a second striker is definately worth a go in my books. He's been completely figured out on the left. So playing him through the middle as a 2nd striker might give us something completely new. This game can certainly be used to experiment with our formation. I definately agree that Dempsey deserves a start. I would start him against Norwich too. Defoe is just missing too many chances at the moment. Dempsey is a more intelligent player. Bale behind Dempsey is a good idea. Lots of pace and creativity. also opens up a space for Townsend or Siggy on the left.

Fanman

Critical_Spur, my last post was a reply to you by the way.

Fanman

I have a feeling that AVB will start Hudd and Livermore in CM? I don't think that he'll start Parker. He needs to be wrapped up in cotton wool for the rest of the season IMO. The europa league will start again soon, so we definately need someone who can come in for Dembele and Parker. We somehow need to keep Bale, Lennon, Dembele and Parker fresh for the league. I think we'll see Hudd and Livermore get some more game time very soon, hopefully Townsend too.

Fanman

Agree with critical - time to drop (not rest) Walker & Defoe. Naughton looked far better on right v Coventry & Benny on left. Siggurdson MUST play in this one - get his spurs career moving and game time.

Windlespur

Windlespur, agreed.

Fanman

I wonder what selection policy AVB will look to for this game, with Norwich next Wednesday? will we see a couple of players rested to keep things fresh, but also give a few a chance to get playing time. For example should BAE start, Should we rest Walker and play Naughton at RB, Should we give Vert another few days break. Similarly could this be a game to rest Lennon and dembele, similarly Defoe? If for example we went with Friedel, Naughton, Dawson (Gallas), Caulker, BAE, Townsend, Parker, Hudd (Livermore), Bale, Siggy and Dempsey, it is a very strong side and you would hope it is good enough to beat Leeds, but also keep a few fresh for Norwich. I do wonder though if the likes of Lennon, Livermore and Townsend would love to get stuck into leeds. All have played there and even in Walker and Naughton as Sheffield boys, I imagine they will all be right up for this one

oxfordspur

Does anyone else remember an away match at Chelsea when we played Lennon down the middle. He was fantastic first half - maybe an option with his pace. For me, Bale's biggest strength is running from deep and using his strength and pace, not laying off, holding up etc.

Windlespur

Cheers Fanman.

This game HAS to be used to find an alternative striker from within the squad. With Gooners having a field day with goals, I fear the goal difference would become vital come the end of the season. Any last minute Levy deals would mean a settling in eriod for the newbie. So with two winnable leage game coming up, we need to find that spark up front desperately. How many games is it now since Defoe found the net?.......Over to you Levy/AVB.

Critical_Spur

Gomez, Noughton, Dawson, Caulker, BAE, Townsend, Livermore, Hudd, Lennon, Siggy and Dempsey. Dembele needs the rest as does Bale, bench time for Walker and Defoe, lets see what Siggy is like in the more central role and give Dempsey a chance up top (as he looks like our attacking cover for the next couple of weeks). Townsend needs the game time. Put Gomez in the shop window or a chance to redeem himself. Noughton has earn the chance at right back!

Slurms McKenzie

we can't expect to beat these guys until we get a bigger stadium...;)

shedboy2

Ox I'd rest Bale and let Lennon continue his fine form following on from United game. With townsend on the other wing and dempsey as teh target with siggy behind we'ed have plenty of pace and ariel threat.

Slurms McKenzie

Based on a lot of previous comments Shedboy I'd have to agree!

Slurms McKenzie

Windlespur, I agree with what you say about Bale, but I think that he is good enough to play anywhere in attack; except maybe as a target man. Critical_Spur, agreed. Defoe hasn't scored since Aston Villa, we definately need something fresh up-front.

Fanman

4,2,3,1 - Whoever in goal (might make sense giving Lloris a rest) - Naughton, Caulker, Dawson, BAE - Carrol, Parker - Lennon, Siggy, Townsend - Dempsey or Obika... Walker and Defoe definitely need to be subs for this one.

rahn DMC

Slurms McKenzie, I think that Bale has had plenty of rest this season, whereas Lennon has been an ever present. I see your point re Lennon's form, but I'd rather him be fresh for Norwich. However, if we play Bale without Lennon and they mark Bale out of the game we don't have anyone who can get behind them apart from Townsend. Its a tough one.

Fanman

To be honest Fanman I had Bale down first with Lennon rested then switched them for the above reason. I kinda think playing Bale would be like trying to crack a nut with a sledge hammer. Although I would like to see Townsend played on either wing just to see what kind of cover he offers!

Slurms McKenzie

The team AVB fielded against Coventry was a good indicator - some rotation but strong side. The full backs were Naughton & BAE, goalie Friedel, Siggy played - rested Dembele & Lennon. I would like to see Lennon play (as Leeds), but agree - rest Bale & Dembele & probably Verts also if sick. Slurms - GOMES - please don't get me started. Friedel, Dawson, Caulker, BAE, Naughton, Lennon, Parker, Carrol, Townsend, Siggy, Dempsey. Norwich bring back Lloris, Bale, Vert, Dembele - see how it goes re: defoe, walker.

Windlespur

Fanman - Bale played v Coventry, Lennon rested - so for me switch for this one as Lennon v old club.

Windlespur

Slurms McKenzie, agreed. Townsend should definately be given a chance.

Fanman

Seems weird that a game against Leeds people suggesting Defoe should get dropped, yes he hasn't scored in a while, so why not geive him a run out, hopefully bang on some goals to get his confidence back, cos if we don't sign a striker this window then its Defoe/Ade all the way, so we need them as confident as possible.

Ossie

Windlespur, my only concern is that Lennon might pick up an injury because he has played so many games this season if not rested. He'll be itching to play against his old club though.

Fanman

Ossie, good point. I think that AVB will see things your way. With Defoe as our only striker this season the last thing we need is for him to totally lose confidence.

Fanman

I'm just fed up of watching Defoe miss chance after chance...

Fanman

Off to Sydney for a holiday over the long weekend. Will miss the game on ESPN unfortunately. but like I always say.....COME ON YOU SPURS & WIN WIN WIN

@coopsie, thanks for the ITK from the previous article :-)

Madaboutspurs

Ossie, Three points: 1) Defoe scoring against Leeds is whoopie....means f-all, 2) we can't keep relying on him as he has let himself and the team down repeatedly and 3) he too needs a rest/break to get his mindset back in order. I am just totally fed up of seeing his usual poor standard for some time now. Someone else deserves a look in IMO and this is an deal opportunity. COYS!

Critical_Spur

from the squad pick the side to do the job and progress, this is a possible banana skin of a game, Lloris; Naughton; Dawson; Vertonghen (if fit) BAE; Lennon; Parker; Dembele; Bale; Dempsey; Defoe and we will progress into the next round, yes we have Norwich midweek, so get the job done and make changes, not the benitez way chasing the game and it's all to late, if anyone gets injured go and spend some money.

spu 4 life

I would start Dempsey up top ith Sigurdsson behind. If we can get that tandem working well, it will allow AVB the option of puttling Defoe as impact sub and making him earn his spot back. Same goes for Walker. Vertonghen will want back in do I'd have him out there with Dawson, BAE and Naughton out wide. Friedel in net. Start with Parker and Dembele in the middle and hope to do the game in early and get them both off at the half along with Townsend a little later. Parker, Dempsey, BAE, Sigurdsson all need to play for the minutes. They will be important going forward. COYS

peterballb

Defoe has to start he needs to score to get starting again and goals bring confidence and this is a game where he may score. I would start Benny and Naughton at RB and may be let Townsend get some game time as well and if we get in front we could give Carroll a run out at some point.

thfan

Hard choice with regards to the team so many need game time, friedal, ekkoto, Parker, Carroll, Huddlestone, Livermore, Townsend, siggy. We need to use as many of these players without loosing the game. Also vertonghen didn't play last week so he could do with a game. Shame it's only 11 a side.

gibbothfc

thfan, you could look at Defoe's scoring history and his confidence is irrelevant. 10 goals in 2009/2010 by November 22. 5 against Wigan, 3 against Hull and 2 more in all of the other fixtures. If he scores 4 against Leeds, he likely doesn;t score again for a month. Get other players scoring. One goal for Sigurdsson and Dempsey continuing to create and score would do more for the "team" than Defoe scoring a goal. 14 goals this season, 9 from 4 and the other 5 from 25. That's Defoe every year. COYS

peterballb

Peter, Precisely my thoughts. A striker at his level does not and should not need games like these to get his confidence back.....how old is he?!!! I also agree, Dempsey and Siggy would gain more confidence (together) and hopefully gel. COYS!

Critical_Spur

We need to win this game and get into the last 16, we must pick a team with a realistic chance of winning, if we prat about too much we could come unstuck. The form book, and all logic, says we should win, but it is a banana skin, and incidently we can well do without a replay. The worry is we have just completed 190 minutes, against both the top and the bottom teams in the PL, had 30+ shots on goal, roughly a half of those on target, and we have scored 1 goal, this must improve if we expect to win games in any competition.

Frank

thfan

You sound surprised by Defoe & his quiet spell.
Defoe has been inconsistent & patchy all his career .Nothing new ,that`s defoe .
,br>For Spurs to be consistent we really need a few more consistent players .Players living off the odd great game gets you nowhere .Nearly players give you a nearly team .Spurs have been that for far too long

big cockeral

Spurs need a manager who can have a 50% or over win ratio .Spurs haven`t had that since .... ? $hit last manager to have that ?

AVB has a win ratio of exactly 50% ,heading in the right direction for sure .Or will we suffer a 3rd season in a row second half season collapse ?
AVB could become legend if he pulls this off

big cockeral

Come on guys - we have seen that avb takes each match seriously, but balances his team and uses his squad. A real positive with resting and others getting opportunities to stay match sharp and to impress. Hudd did not against Coventry, but siggy showed good signs. Siggy and Dempsey for me.

Windlespur

Friedel, Naughton, Dawson, Caulker, Esso, Parker, Carroll, Towensend, Gyilfi, Bale and Defoe for me

spurspanther

Thfan you right DEFOE HAS TO START. Like or not he is our only out and out sticker (Ade is playing worse), last time he played at Eland rd he got two goals. Defoe needs goals to build confidence and then could go on a goal scoring run against Norwich, Newcastle, west brom and west ham, all teams many of you think he scores all his goals against.

Diouf really impressed me against Everton and the chavs during their league cup run. Still think we will be way to much for them.

T.H.F.Chris

I was going to post "throw in Coulibaly" but then noticed the article that we had loaned him to some obscure Italian club. What is behind that? I thought part of his development included having English language lessons. Don't know what he will gain in Italy.....apart from exposure to racism. I expect the powers that be know what they are doing. I also read that Pritchard is a target of Liverpool. I hope we hang on to him. I don't think we should risk Defoe, play Demps up front or give Obika a run. But don't underestimate the Leeds team.

jacobslad

THF Chris you're right in that a few goals in this game could do wonders for Defoe's confidence and send him on a run. However, were he injured we would be absolutely pucked. Without a doubt. So for me its Dempsey up front. I think that Lennon will play given the time he spent at Leeds, a club he actually didn't want to leave. I can imagine him asking AVB to play in this one. I think Bale might be the one to take a rest in this one, as someone suggested earlier. Other than that I think Parker will be rested with the Sandro situation, as will Dembele. I would like to see Carroll paired with one of Huddlestone/Livermore but I think it's more likely that both the latter play. The team for me: Friedel : Naughton, Caulker, Dawson, BAE : Lennon, Huddlestone, Livermore, Townsend : Gylfi : Dempsey

WhiteHartHotspur

Oh and jacobslad I think the expectation is that Coulibaly will get a lot of playing time with Grosseto as they are struggling near the bottom of Serie B. If he goes nuts over there and returns for next season ready for first team action, I'm all for it. Though I agree the racism won't be particularly nice. Also agree that we have to hang on to Pritchard.

WhiteHartHotspur

WhiteHH...yes but it still seems a bloody long way to send the lad! I would like to see Carroll start as well, or at least be on the bench.

jacobslad

I do not agree with some of the above suggestions as far as the line up is concerned! For me strongest possible line up! Leeds are up for this game, no messing about, we need to win this game outright, no replay please !

AllanDK

Play chelsea like formation....3 creative mid fielders behind the clinical striker and a deep lying playmaker...A formation which can be used against teams like stokecity,sunderland who plays defensively where wingers like aaron lennon and gareth bale doesnt have space..... Defoe-st attk- midGlyfi,Tom carrol,Dempsy def mid- Thuddle stone,livermore def-ekotto,caulker,dawson,naughton gk-fridel sub parker(def mid),dembele(attk mid),youth striker(obika)

Navaneeth

Judging from the way AVB have lined up so far this season, namely; always strongest possible team has been selected. Therefore, IMO he will only make two changes from the ManU game, - namely: Brad in goal and Ekotto to start ! " BoasBall Style " all the way!!!

AllanDK

WHH injury is a bit of a concern but at the moment I feel it could be worth the risk, play Defoe first 70 mins enough time to score a couple then sub ideally for Obika - he is probably third choice. I'd rest Lennon unless he is desperate to play.

T.H.F.Chris

peterbalb - I agree to a certain extent but i do think when Defoe goes through this stage he then needs a goal to kick start another scoring spree before his goals dry up again. Fact is we don't have any one else to play up top while Ade is away other than Dempsey and Siggy he hasn't scored. I just feel it is best to try and give him confidence be positive becuase in reality until we get a prolific striker we have to try and get the best out of the ones we have.

Big C I am not surprised I know what Defoe is like and yes he shouldn't need these short of games to get confidence but some strikers are like that, look at Torres he has been woeful yet he was prolific. I just think we have to make the best of what we got until things change and I think it would be more positive to play Defoe than drop him because I am not convinced Dempsey and Siggy have proven enough to get us the goals. Siggy has been woeful and is only just starting to show signs of settling in and Dempsey has been woeful until last few games. Defoe is a type of player that ca grab you a goal out of nothing despite his flaws.>br>
Personally I think Defoe is not good enough for us as a team now looking to become a CL team but then again is Dempsey, Siggy, Ade, Lennon, Walker, Dembele, Dawson, Naughton, Hudd, Livermore, and so forth. there is logic of me saying play Defoe that is we need to keep him as confident as possible if we are to get any more goals out of him because we don't actually have any one else that has proven to be better at the moment. no point in kicking a player down when we don't have any better. Some say try Dempsey and Siggy well yes we could but as I said have they been prolific especially Siggy, it woulld be a gamble starting with both of them and dropping Defoe and if we did start with tem and we didin't score how many would say 'can't believe we didn't play Defoe'. some times we just have to learn to accept some players are not good enough for our aspirations but we have to keep them positive until we get better.

thfan

Sorry, I disagree with thoe that think that this match could potentially help Defoe with his confidence. One could say the same for walker!. Defoe, for a player that has been around for a looooong time, imo, his confidence will only return by scoring on a big stage or in a big game, e.g., against a top 4 side. Besides, the likes of Dempsey or a.n.other deserves a chance. Scoring today would mean NOTHING if he then goes on another barren spell. Until we sign someone else, we need to desperately find an alternative contributor (striker) to the goals tally. COYS!

Critical_Spur

With the Norwich fixture on wednesday i would like to see players rested but we could easily lose this game if we do.

MrSpurs

thefan, Just read your post and it crossed mine! Just to elaborate on my thinking. Look at Dempsey, he is cock-a-hoop with confidence after AGAIN scoring against Utd. With the limited opps Dempsey has had, he is beginning to gain support and I would like to see him maintain momentum. Defoe may still benefit should he score coming on as an impact sub when all round him are tiring. COYS!

Critical_Spur

I really don't know what to make of Defoe other than that he is good, but not good enough. There's been lots of talk on here and elsewhere about him needing to get games to score, or that he needs game to bolster his confidence, but having watched him down the years, it seems like when he has a run of games and is knocking them in, and being lauded by the pundits, that he inexplicably goes off the boil. There appears to be no rhyme or reason to when he is full of confidence and scoring freely, and when he's not. It's worrying to think that he's our first choice striker. We should have better in our ranks.

darkenvai

well said darkenvai. Be ready to heat humple pie though, should he be in the starting lineup and bang in a hatrick!! COYS!

Critical_Spur

I'd queue up for hours for a slice of that pie! I'd much rather that he scored one goal every other game or so though.

darkenvai

Where's the transfer gossip!

jonathan01

Defoe for me should not play. If he gets injured then what?? Risk it with Obika. Even if he fails to score there are enough goals an enough quality in the rest of the team to neat these lot an well. Defoe I can't stand anyway

BrooksySpurs

darkenvai- to me defoe seems to score freely when he has something to prove,hence at the start of the season he had a point to prove to his previous manager when he started every game.now hes the automatic first/only choice striker,there is no pressure on him to score as he assumes he will play the following game regardless.....credit where credit is due,he was fantastic as the lone striker earlier on in the season, as its not natural role, but maybe he's a bit too complacent now.(just my 2 cents worth).

g. roberts testes

Brooksy - if he gets injured better he gets injured now whilst there are still a couple of days of the transfer window left.

SpuriousLife

I expect this to be Adebayor's biggest contribution to Spurs for this season. What, you ask. How can this be? Adebayor's in South Africa and won't be playing? My point precisely. What can AVB and staff do to light a spark under this man to get him back to playing at last season's level. The best he can do for us these days is to leave for a few weeks. Strange, indeed.

Total knobhead

Ah, and tomorrow's match vs Leeds U. Let's see a wee bit of rotation. Perhaps Siggy should start and Lennon can come on late. Dembele not to play a full match, he's not been on top of his game. When is Kaboul coming back? Cup matches the perfect place to work him back into the lineup.

Total knobhead

g. roberts testes - I hear what you say, and there might be something to that, but, as has been pointed out on previous threads, he consistently wastes lots of chances。I saw a stat recently that had his success rate at a measly 14% or so. Adebayor was down in the 12% region, although from far fewer chances. Given the number of chances that Defoe had had, and they were really numerous, even a relatively small increase in that percentage would likely translate into a significant number of point won. He was good earlier in the season, and has been in the past. Not good enough though, sadly.

darkenvai

darkenvai- those stats speak for themselves.can't say that i was ever a defoe fan,and thats putting it extremely mildly,for the reasons that you stated.plus he just shoots on sight and is a bit one dimensional.during the man u match he was shooting without even looking up first.....the time to phase him out has to start now....even tomorrow.so we can make way for others in the team.i feel we need a personnel total change up front,if not now then definitely in the summer.(yes the record is stuck,gently tap the needle).

g. roberts testes

Only make changes to either rest anybody carrying knocks or to get comeback-ees fit, like Scotty and BAE. Definitely play Dempsey as he's getting better with every game. Off topic, but I've just watched the second half of last week's game again and the after-match discussions. Hats off to Mr Foy yet again and I believe he was spot on. It's a fine line but to me Rooney played the ball away to his right but continued to run straight into Caulker. Too often fouls are given when players come together like this. Players are entitled to put themselves between the ball and the opponent without it being obstruction or a trip so long as they are challenging for the ball. Rooney fouled Caulker if anything.

Love totty

I would start (4,3,3): Lloris,Naughton,Caulker,Verts,BAE,Livermore,Carroll,Siggurdson, Townesend,Dempsey,Defoe

SpursSnM

After much study of the squad and the younger players available to us. With the aid of very complex maths equations I have distilled down the area for the squad that needs addressing. We are lacking in the striker department. I know this will come as a surprise to most on here but my figures are accurate. Most probably haven't realised this due to the extreme complexity of the formula needed to work this out. For this reason I am not too critical of AVB and Levy for not working it out. For my next feat of awesomeness will atempt to work out where my nose is located!

Slurms McKenzie

Slurms McKenzie, lol nice one.

Fanman

its great to see the kids today copying the player play acting an trying to get other players sent off, ie ballboy

123spurs

Apprently 123Spurs they are know as ballbags around cardiff

Slurms McKenzie

slurms your nose is not near Cardiff....or I hope, your ballbag...best keep working on that formula!!...;)

shedboy2

Windle Lennon down the middle has long been an option IMO, good call. Townsend should start with Naughton at RB

tophobunty

SpursSnM you playing for a defeat?

tophobunty

Harry Redknapp the tactical genius...what a superstar, the greatest manager of all time

tophobunty

I have always admired Defoe, not because if his overall product, but for what he can do. He scores world class goals. Defoe is now 29 years old. He isn't going to change now. Defoe does not do much unless he scores. He does not score enough. It's not good enough. We outgrew him four or five seasons ago. We still have him because we just cannot find that top striker, and/or won't spend the money. I think top strikers are the hardest to come by. We actually have one on our books, sadly, so far this season he has not come close to his abilities and we are paying him a lot of money.

asherthesmasher

Maybe he'll hang out of his car window and say "Yeah Jeff, we were $hit".

Crissybwoy

adebayor scores

ghulamville

The wish list shrinks again, Sissoko to Newcastle, Coutinho to Liverpool, can't wait for our move or the announcement "we tried hard to get things done, but it's difficult (to Spurs) in January, the problem is other teams keep sneaking in, and nicking all the players we wanted", but don't worry we are sure we can manage with 1.5 strikers, especially when the big idle prat comes back from his African holidays.

Frank

Very amusing Slurms, and unfortunately very very close to the truth.

Frank

i luv it frank,everytime someone signs anybody without fail you are the 1st on,

ghulamville

Defoe blows hot and cold like most strikers. He's worth keeping for when he's hot because hes top notch when on form. Unfortunatley he's all weve got at the moment and he's colder than my house at the moment. He needs help, the squad needs ANOTHER BLOODY STRIKER.

HuddersfieldYiddo

True. But that if we somehow don't sign a striker an this FA Cup game screws him over

BrooksySpurs

Ghulamville, I'll be first on when we sign somebody, but I shouldn't hold your breath

Frank

Just watching Togo, there is one thing for sure, Adebayor will not come back tired, the big idle prat, he makes Berbatov look energetic, there is more go in a Beecham's Pill.

Frank

Slurms McKenzie, this is why we should have never have got rid of Rednapp. Striker short are we, just ask Sandra to fill in - better than Bent!

In-spurs-ational

Crissybwoy, he'll say "Triffic performance by the lads. I told them to concentrate on the league and not worry about Mickey mouse cups like this one. That's exactly what they did. Triffic"

In-spurs-ational

If we don't sign a top striker this window I will smash something very expensive belonging to the wife!

LongTimeSpursFan64

LongTimeSpursFan64, I think you need to re phrase that to "belonging to (the soon to be ex) wife"

In-spurs-ational

I Think in future we should ban any talk of transfers during the 'normal' window and only be allowed to discuss it on the LAST day, the Levy (D) day. It's either genuinely no buys or DL is trying to make AVB's job more difficult. FFS, if a new striker is being considered, he would just be gelling in by the time the season ends! Why put the fans, the team, the manager through this window after window?. Bet Levy buys his x-mas presents in the bargain basement in the last 10 minutes of x-mas eve and then telsl his wife, Sorry luv was looking for a £500 watch but they only had the 20 pounders in stock!

Critical_Spur

@ In-spur-rational, Her nose job cost a pretty penny I can tell you.

LongTimeSpursFan64

Anybody want to wager that we don't sign anyone in this window? Happy to put £10 for charity where my mouth is. I'm positive we won't sign anyone. Unfortunately our owners lack any ambition. It amazes me that they think they can skimp on the playing squad keeping us the perpetual nearly men of the PL. they then expect to build a 55,000 seater stadium for a team whose ambition stretches to hopefully winning one domestic trophy every 25 years or so. They then have the temerity to think this will be enough to get 55,000 to pay £40 each week to come along to WHL. And these are supposed the business geniuses we should never question. A lemming I am not.

SpuriousLife

LongTimeSpursFan64, make sure that's not the thing you smash! Anyway I'm an optimist (you have to be to support Spurs). I'm confident that there will be no need to smash anything as we will indeed sign a top striker. In fact, I hear we are in for Messi as when Levy was asked how the striker situation was going, he said "we are going to get messy in this transfer window"

In-spurs-ational

SpuriousLife. Okay mate. You're on. If we sign someone (excluding Holtby, because that's not really a signing) you owe £10 to one of my favourite charities, rainbows http://www.rainbows.co.uk/ if we don't sign anyone, who would you like me to donate to.

In-spurs-ational

I'll have a tenner with you Spurious ...My charity is The Firefighters Charity!!!

woodyn17

Spuriouslife, Careful mate!. I know you mean well (re charity) but there could be many takers. I am confident of some last day dealings (note plural!). AVB is ambitious and will be needing a midfielder and a striker to aim for top 4. Otherwise we may have to sacrifice our cup runs to focus on the PL. The squad, as it stands, doesn't have the required depth. I also think there will be one or two heading out of WHL. COYS!

Critical_Spur

woodyn17, to be fair to SpuriousLife, if we do sign someone, perhaps (s)he can give £5 to each of our charities. If we don't sign someone I'm happy to give £10 to SpuriousLife's choice

In-spurs-ational

Critical_Spur, of course there will be signings. Levy can't resist the end of the January sales!

In-spurs-ational

in-spurs, In deed!. To be fair to Levy, regardless of how he handles it, he has always supported his new mnagers. I would go as far as saying that of all our recent managers, AVB has earned it. He has worked wonders with an inherited squad (minus the obvious) and I can't wait to see what type of players he (AVB) has in mind. We have thus far judged AVB on on an ongoing basis. I would love to see how HIS chosen signings fit in to the jigsaw (project).....would make for some interesting debates.

Critical_Spur

Critical_Spur, I agree AVB has earned some of "his" signings. However, the type of player AVB wants to take us to "the next level" doesn't come cheap. Unfortunately, the best time to buy these types of players is normally at the end of the season. That's why you don't often see the big clubs buying much in January. The top players normally move at the end of the season and we are approaching being a top team.

In-spurs-ational

Triffic post on the performance In-spurs-ational. Did I mention that Crouchy's a good player?

Crissybwoy

In-spurs and woodyn we're on. I'll let you know my charity if we don't sign anyone. This is one bet I hope to lose. COYS!

SpuriousLife

I expect Frunk to commit suicide before we sign another player.

tophobunty

Yeh, triffic player that Crouchy.

In-spurs-ational

FAir point In-Spurs. But surely, it is now 3 consecutive seasons that we have been sitting pretty in top4 at this stage and in each season we needed just a tweak to maintain that level. It may not need to be a marquee signing to achieve that. If we don't make CL this season, not only do we risk losing some of our ambitious players, we also risk not attracting BIG signings. I am confident that we won't suffer the usual 2nd half burn-out of yeateryears. So a squad depth-seeking signing(s) may suffice 'til summer. It would be interesting to see if AVB has any 2nd tier players in mind. I also think AVB knows that his wish at Spurs will need to be radically different to that when he was a Chelsea.

Critical_Spur

He's got everything. Two arms, two legs, left foot, right foot, the boys got the lot

In-spurs-ational

SpuriousLife, don't need to bother as it'll be you paying out!

In-spurs-ational

Critical_Spur, my only fear is that Levy sees not signing anyone as a win win. If we get fourth, he'll have not spent any money so he's happy. If we don't get fourth we can probably sell Bale for a heap of cash, so Levy is happy again.

In-spurs-ational

should read - his wish list

Critical_Spur

In a way it's easier for AVB here than at Chelsea regarding signing players. If we sign someone for £10m and he's a flop, it's not a huge deal as we can probably move him on for a small loss. At Chelsea if he signs someone for £50m and he's a flop, well he's Torres then :)

In-spurs-ational

we will make a signing,i am positive about that,but it will be hugely underwhelming one,thats the worry

ghulamville

ITK update. Levy has told AVB to make a big name signing. The player's surname must have at least 13 letters to help with shirt sales.

In-spurs-ational

Rumours saying the deal to sign Ba from Newcastle feel through due to Levy asking him to change his name to Barbarian are false though

In-spurs-ational

The Scum have a strike force of Walcott, Giroud, Gervinho, Podolski and Chamack. Spurs have just Defoe. I know that Defoe us better than all of that lot put together but perhaps Mr Levy one more striker wouldn't hurt.

MrSpurs

"If we sign someone for £10m and he's a flop, it's not a huge deal as we can probably move him on for a small loss"

Not while Levy is at the helm. How much did Bentley cost us....or still costing us?!!!!

Critical_Spur

Mt Spurs. Chamack as you call him is at West Ham and if you inc Podolski, Walkcott and Gervinho you must include, Lennon, Bale, Townsend and Dempsey, so your argument doesnt stack at all. But I do agree we need another forward. We also need another midfielder

tophobunty

Critical we paid 15 million for Bentley and can't shift him. Levy sanctioned that deal, as far as i see it Levy just can't win here, damned if he does and damned if he doesnt.

tophobunty

Confident that AVB will select a team that uses some fringe players but is picked and instructed in a manner that will produce a win.

judge

Play Defoe, he has said he is looking forward to playing, as he scored a hatrick last time at Leeds... rest of team... pretty much as other posters on here, Verts back in walker dropped, brad in goal. We must have our best team ok for the Norwich game, as win is a must have result.

Block D Spurs

Block D Spurs, I'd play Defoe as well. Above all, he is a confidence player whose confidence of probably low at the moment. A few goals against Leeds and he could start banging them in again in the league

In-spurs-ational

"whose confidence *is* probably low"

In-spurs-ational

Should we pass the test today our number in the draw is 8; Numbers 1 Luton Town 2 Oldham Athletic or Liverpool 3 Wigan Athletic 4 Blackburn Rovers 5 Barnsley 6 Middlesbrough 7 Millwall 8 Leeds United or Tottenham Hotspur 9 Arsenal 10 Manchester City 11 Manchester United 12 Brentford or Chelsea 13 Reading 14 Huddersfield Town or Leicester City 15 Milton Keynes Dons 16 Everton *Fifth round ties will take place over the weekend of February 16th and 17th.

spu 4 life

wow, it is just never harry's fault is it. having listed the individual pedigree of most of the team who amazingly failed to see off MK Dons, the solution? he has to replace them.

Guernman

guernman, its hilarious isnt it? typical harry management. when you tell a team with the natural talent of lennon, modric, vdv bale etc. to go and play footall they will win games! when you tell it to qpr division 2 teams will score 4 goals past you. he clearly needs more £80 thousand a week players to help qpr join portsmouth.

spurticus87

Come on you spurs, Come on you spurs, Come on you, Spurs are on their way to Wembley, Tottenhams gonna do it again, They cant stop em, the boys from Tottenham, The boys from White Hart Lane, Spurs are on their way to Wembley, The kings are claiming the throne, Everybody will be singing, When the Spurs go marching on,

spu 4 life

Bring in number 9 the Spu

T.H.F.Chris

It must be a concern to the most ardent ILWT campaigner, even those who are intellectually challenged (no name, no pack drill) that one of our main rivals for 4th place have just spent £12M on a striker, Sturridge (currently 3 in 3), and £8.5M on a quality creative MFer Coutinho. These signings won't excatly make them weaker, that is a certainty, they are currently 7 points behind us, and improving. Do we now wait for Liverpool to go bust, as is the popular belief on here, sign a player equals bankruptcy. Meanwhile we of course, although we have a widely recognised 4 year old problem of the lack of a striker, even the most committed Levy supporters are prepared to concede that, and really need a creative MFer to open teams up, do nothing. We are told the club's value has doubled in the last few years, so what, is there anything in that to benefit fans, who are not share holders, of course not. But our two "fans" Messrs Lewis, an Levy and their cohorts, will be delighted, after all neither of them give a bugger for what happens on the pitch, especially Lewis, who would probably struggle to name 10 of the players. At least Levy turns up to entertain his cronies on cucumber sandwiches and g&ts even if he hasn't got a bloody clue what's going on on the pitch.

Frank

Frank.... It always makes me chuckle when I see our esteemed Chairperson in his club quilted jacket with D L printed on the front. In my opinion it says everything there is to say about the bloke. Unless of course it's there to remind Joe Lewis that his name isn't "Oi You There"

thfc1882whl

Frank - the thing that puzzles me the most about the ILWT brigade is the dichotomy that exists between what Levy/Lewis/ENIC are willing to provide as a team on the pitch and their expectancy that they will be able to convince 55,000 to pay £50 each week to come and watch a team that has as the peak of it's expectation to win a domestic cup every 20 years or so. We'll have a solid balance sheet though so perhaps they expect to get 55,000 people to come each week to have a look at that instead. Of course maybe we'll never have a 55,000 seater stadium so the point becomes moot. After all we've been waiting for the stadium build to start longer than we've been waiting for a striker!

SpuriousLife

Frank - agree with that...why do we wait till the end of the window?...Pool knew they had a problem and so resolved it...sturidge in nice and early. Arse although slammed for not buying (giroud, podolski carzola) are in fact in transition and starting to gel....We have just lost our best player of the year and what do we do? feck about arguing about a kids price....

shedboy2

spot on frank, watch levy bring in holtby at the last min to make the fans happy, but wont get the striker that we really need.feckin joke!

topspur53

that's just it spurious...it won't be ENIC's problem if they fill the 55k stadium, they'll be looking to be out about that time....I just can't understand all this supporting of balance sheets/good management etc by fans who haven't quite figured out the difference between ENIC and Spurs and that there is a conflict of interest happening...

shedboy2

Frank

Daniel Levy has got 4 days to prove you wrong ,or i really hope not ,but prove you right .

big cockeral

Your expectations for the new stadium is probably close to the truth. It may well be that the new stadium will have to wait for a change of ownership to actually get built.

Frank

Your expectations for the new stadium is probably close to the truth. It may well be that the new stadium will have to wait for a change of ownership to actually get built.

Frank

we are far more likely to be bankcrupt by a £450m debt for a stadium than we are for a striker...both have no guarantee of being successful.

shedboy2

IMO... Daniel Levy is very aware of what is going on in the dressing room and on the pitch... he is following the brief from Joe Lewis.. which i think is..get the club property base established.. i.e. new training ground, new stadium. Think for a moment.. how many top world class players have signed for us in last 8 years?? Can we pay £200k a week wages to 6 players... have we signed £30m+ players ?...WE have to live within our financial abilities,, Levy had to get the training ground built, and now the stadium. This is a fine balancing act when you take into account the hundreds of millions pounds it all costs then we have the playing staff. At the same time, success demanded by the fans... Levy knows what he is doing, building up the club and ENIC may sell in 4 or 5 years or so...(2 years to build stadium and settle down there... by which time we will have become established top 4 club and top quality players..With a value of about £800m + COYS..

Block D Spurs

Block D - do you believe we can build the stadium and stay in the top4?...I don't, we just will not buy the players that are needed.

shedboy2

The other factor in this transfer window is Pardew/Ashley and their ambition to sign most of the Foreign Legion. Although they are no risk to our league position, the backing of Ashley for his manager, again, is refreshing. If they consolidate their PL status as a result, how many Geordie fans will be losing any sleep re. their balance sheet, or debt position. The answer is none, it's not their business or concern, they simply want to see their team win football matches, as as all fans do, except it would appear a significant number of Spurs fans, who seem to fancy themselves as amateur economists.

Frank

shedboy2 Arsenal did it . We have spent more money on players in the last 10 years than Arsenal . Don`t buy big ,buy smart .
Previous managers have wasted money ,we have beaten Arsenals transfer record with Bent ,Bentley & Defoe ,that`s shocking .Throw keane in ,Palacios,Pav,Bassong & we have spent over the odds for alot of players .
Adebayor is looking one seriously bad buy .We may never be able to ship him off ,whose going to pay him the wages he earns here ? .
We get stuck with players who are overpaid ,but can`t keep the ones that want to go the next level .Bale will be next

big cockeral

shedboy2- we are not buying the playerd we need now, let alone after the stadium (fantasy) is built.i feel ENIC would have sold up before they build the stadium, but the drop in value of land has effected their plan.

topspur53

Block D where did £200K/wk, and £30M come from, nobody is asking for that. Is it not possible to sign a striker for less than £30M, the example I used of Sturridge and Coutino to Liverpool, cost £20M for the pair an neither will be earning £100K never mind £200K, how much did Dember Ba cost? In your vision of the future you again mention the value of the club being £800m, so what, great for Lewis/Levy, doesn't matter a $hit to a fan, unless of course he is a shareholder. A fan would rather see top players on the pitch, rather than Bahamas Joe, and Lacky Levy living in the lap of luxury having sold the club and buggered off.

Frank

Incidently Block D Spurs, your schedule for "building up the property" is way out, there has just been announced an extended completion date of 2018 on the staddium, which may well be further extended yet, then as you say at least 2 years to settle in, so it will be at 2020-21 before we see any tangeable benefits on the pitch, that's 7 years at least, so do we have to wait that long for a striker, unfortunately by then most of our current stars will be retired or thereabouts, an will all have to have been replaced, hopefully.

Frank

Bc- yep Arse did it but (and I hate to say it) Arsen has been a genius and was ahead of the curve...all teams now think they can buy young talent and train them on....but it can't work, as all can't be successful at it. We're stuck between a rock and a hard place but imo the focus has to be on retaining competitiveness on the pitch....
Top- I suspect that's why we haven't spent in the past two years our player transfer budget is being used for ither things...

shedboy2

wolfwinkle would cost about 10mil, and would be a lot better than having nobody in the box on the end of all these crosses we put in. ffs..

topspur53

shedboy... my ITK guy who has known Joe Lewis & Daniel Levy for many years.. has told me Joe is inputting a massive amount of money to build the stadium.. so the LTV (loan to value) is about 50% or less, when using Bank finance / loans. Remember.. Levy said 18 months the finance was in place for the new stadium. As I said, I think there is money avail. my guess is £40m, so a couple of players will have to go.. Bentley, JJ Gomez? to increase the transfer kitty and free up wages ability.

Block D Spurs

tops- I thought wolfwinkle had re-committed to stay in Portugual? but he would be a good 'cheap' option....he may train on and at least has decent touch. I'd prefer Negredo even those his pace may be seen as a weakness.

shedboy2

Brentford 1 x 0 Chelsea. A moment of hope in a miserable world.

Total knobhead

block- I hope you're right, you're itk has been pretty good! They did say it wouldn't affect our transfers but as fans we need to make sure they stick to what they say and don't lose focus on the football!

shedboy2

'those' = 'though'....talking of losing focus on the football...time's pressing.

shedboy2

benteke cost villa £7.5 mil, so who needs to pay £30mil for a striker block d.

topspur53

Of course we should not pay £30m.. RVP cost £22m... unless it is someone similar ability to L. Messi Levy has always tried to buy cheap and sell high.. Carrick Berba, Modrick..etc. After all..Daniel Levy is a Jewish bean counter!!

Block D Spurs

Block D Spurs

Always usually agree with you but you must remember the players you mentioned actually all forced their moves .

big cockeral

Happy with the line up. No Defoe or Walker. Naughton on right. COYS!

Critical_Spur

Just seen the team...interesting. Tottenham: Friedel, Naughton, Caulker, Vertonghen, Assou-Ekotto, Huddlestone, Parker, Lennon, Bale, Sigurdsson, Dempsey. Subs: Gomes, Walker, Townsend, Livermore, Dembele, Dawson, Obika. Wonder what is happening with Defoe?

muttley

bollox. Oscar scores for Chelsea and the dream of Brentford dims. Still 1 x 1, but Chelscum look more awake.

Total knobhead

we clearly need two players in this window, we should all know which two positions to allow us to maintain the gap to Liverpool and of course Arsenal who will most likely come on strong again as they have us to shoot at again. We all know this, some want to crucify the owners and board at every opportunity as see a great chance to do that here. I want us to sign two players but not at the expense of going brain dead.

tophobunty

Hudds and Benny start too!

Critical_Spur

Is Defoe injured? not even on the bench. Maybe we are swapping him for Rob Green?

tophobunty

Well impressed with that team .Glad Caulker starts massive future for us imo ,could be the next King .Great to see BAE ,man love for that player .Hudd & Siggy need to give AVB with a selection headache with a good game today ,both have made it easy to be benched . Naughton is getting better & better & could dislodge the error prone Walker
Defoe & Walker both needed dropping ,been very average for a while now .

big cockeral

Frank.. from my experience in property development financing.. there is always allowances for costs overruns, and time scale.. just in case...as you have said many times before.. Joe Lewis & Daniel Levy have been here since 2001 and still no stadium. Perhaps they took the route of buying the club from Alan Sugar after he rescued us, (they paid him £22m i think) and get their financial security in place first... Shareholding control, and THFC De listed.. as they could have built the stadium years ago, and would have been subject to various parties interference...and have to share the value and eventual sale profits of the club & assets. So from a business point of view, it makes sense to own your company, and assets, before spending more of your own money on improving / building a stadium which will be of benefit to other major shareholders...Don't forget over the years Levy has backed his managers in transfer amounts...more than most PL club chairmen have. COYS

Block D Spurs

Defoe must be injured?? when in the week he said ''looking forward to sunday''

spu 4 life

Very happy to see Walker given a rest and the return of Verts and BAE. Strong lne-up and there can be no excuses today imo. Leeds Becchio won't feature so their goal threat is practically nullified before the starting whistle. 0-3 for me

bowerman

Glad that Defoe has been dropped. It will be interesting to see how Siggy and Dempsey get on. I wish Sandro wasn't out for the season, Parker will have to recover for Wednesday. I think that playing Huddlestone means that we're a man down...

Fanman

brain dead, will be not signing the two players we need, esp, a striker. lets see

topspur53

defoe having medical at QPR probs...lol

topspur53

oh well let's hope we get this game put to bed early, some how i think we will lose or draw can't see us winning, that's some bench we have full of goalscorers. I can see the after match post's ''we need a striker''

spu 4 life

Defoe did have an MRI scan last week ,so something there

big cockeral

Bigc.. yes, and Levy got the max price for them..making us good profits from all the alleged tapping up of our players, by the biggest club in UK.

Block D Spurs

Big C. Agree with your comment re team(individuals) thought.

May be Hudds been given a chance for a hair cut.

Critical_Spur

Rogers is starting to make liverpool gel and they are moving forward. He is being backed in the transfer market, AVB isnt. Levy and Lewis need to start backing AVB because spurs are standing still.

whitehartmart

Is the game on tv today?

spurticus87

pen brentford

spu 4 life

Where is Carroll? Really suprised he's not even on the bench... Much rather have him playing instead of Hudd.

rahn DMC

GOAL GOAL GOAL GOAL VVVGOAL GOAL GOAL GOAL GOAL

spu 4 life

I don't think that we have enough players to compete for 4th place, the FA cup and the europa league. Surely Levy has to recognise this and go into the market? We need cover for DM, an AM and obviously a ST. Hopefully we can do a deal to get Holtby in now.

Fanman

Brentford 2 x 1 Chelscum! I dislike the Blues about as much as I dislike Arse-n-l.

Total knobhead

forrester scored, brentford took TROTTA off what a plonker

spu 4 life

spurticus87 footballstreaming.info mate

spu 4 life

Maybe Livermore will get some game time? Perhaps he should of started today?

Fanman

watched gary cahill at bolton and he never played the way he does now, his like a terry mark 2, movement, tackles, passing, just like terry does what a mike hunt

spu 4 life

Fanman, we really don't need cover for DM. Parker and Livermore are good enough to see out this season. However you are definitely right about the striker, and a creative midfielder... I would also like us to look at Son from HSV, he would provide great competition with Bale and Lennon/ strikers. Really wish we had gone in for Coutinho as well. Absolute bargain at 8.5M

rahn DMC

rahn ....was going to post exactly the same comment. I wonder why he has been excluded these past 2 months? Apparently AVB doesn't want to loan him out, so I thought this game would be a chance to further judge his potential.

jacobslad

Is wiltshire shrek twin of shrek rooney?

spu 4 life

any links 4 the game anyone

rovinella62spurs

phuck it torres has scored, his tee shirt said ''free the chillian miners''

spu 4 life

rovinella62spurs see post 5 or 6 above

spu 4 life

rahn DMC, maybe you're right about the DM position. Hopefully Livermore can do a job, we'll see how it goes anyway. I Just think that we need more quality than Livermore in there.

Fanman

Rafa Benitez be sinking.

Total knobhead

Fanman +1 .If we`re not careful we may lose out on all of them .
Eggs in baskets & all that

big cockeral

Fanman - Ultimately I think we will get better than what Livermore offers, however I think funds would be more wisely spent elsewhere (striker). Hopefully when Livermore plays he can get some of his form from last season back.

rahn DMC

big cockeral, if we don't do anything in this window. I think we'll all be absolutely furious. Both Arsenal and Liverpool are finding the back of the net now. We need investment.

Fanman

Total knobhead, lets hope so.

Fanman

rahn DMC, agreed. Holtby and a quality striker would be excellent. big cockeral, we definately need to be careful, player fitness levels are key now. At least AVB is resting Dembele today. Hopefully we can put the game to bed early and get Lennon or Bale off.

Fanman

thanks spu

rovinella62spurs

Is there any streams of the game?

gibbothfc

Stream anyone? Only just realised the time!

jackcnichols

http://myp2p.cd/

big cockeral

What is Friedel up to with his long kicks loosing possession? We have been too relaxed.COYS

Big Ron

thats a real joke of a goal...sleeping defenders

rovinella62spurs

1-0 leeds

rahn DMC

http://www.firstrow1.eu/watch/165686/1/watch-leeds-united-vs-tottenham-hotspur.html

rovinella62spurs

Caulker sadly showing whatb a donkey he can still be, still a lot to learn for that boy. No pace through the middle up front need anyone say

tophobunty

Defoe injured can be a blessing in Disguise.New Striker Plleease!

SilwalYid

why has nobody bought that bald kent pensioner in goal for us a fekin CAP??????????? would it slip off his head?

tophobunty

i see old tommy hundred-stone is back to his pie 'n' mash diet, he looks well out of shape, u can see his belly under the jersey ffs! what the ***** is he doing on the pitch its a disgrace for a well paid prem footballer, we may aswell have ten men on the pitch his passing has been woeful since he came back also si he cant even offer that!

lillywhites101

where is bale gone missing for a world class player

123spurs

bale is up againts a 4 year old full back but he just wont stay wide !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

tophobunty

bale is all hype

123spurs

My word! Hudd is too slow...

dcruzer

whole team not clicking at all today,

123spurs

why the fu....k have bale and lennon switched...............!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

tophobunty

i want to marry lillywhites101.... Tommy Hundred-stone CLASSIC........

tophobunty

tommy hundred-stone is back lol ...My wordg ! Hudd is too slow...been saying that for months, tug boat hudd.......his shi7e

spu 4 life

shocking attempt by bale should of easily made it 1-1

123spurs

Dempsey leading the line is a bit like defending yourslef against a tank with a half eaten tomato

tophobunty

PARKER is the only one with any drive

spu 4 life

what the f is bale doing on the right and lennon on the left...inverted wingers as much use as having an invrerted cock, who wants one of them?

tophobunty

Siggy down ..no phucking loss if he has to go off

spu 4 life

i think we should bring on one of our vast array of forwards in the second half.

tophobunty

BALE ON THE RIGHT 111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

tophobunty

what a load of rubbish, havent even tested the keeper, very poor all round great save from brad to keep it 1-o

123spurs

Our final ball is the difference between being 1-0 down and leading in this game, get that right and we win it.

spu 4 life

Problem is Hudd. Dembele needs to replace him. Also, Walker in for Naughton and Obika on for Siggy.

dcruzer

Sounds really rubbish, full capacity, 1-0 and no atmosphere, what have Leeds come to...

Need to bring a striker on, this is getting a little silly now not having at least three in the squad.

T.H.F.Chris

tophobunty what about GOMES up front? he might get his nose on the end of a cross?

spu 4 life

Gareth Bale on the RIGHT is a joke & a farce
Aaron Lennon on the LEFT is a joke & a farce.
Lennons hardly touched the ball & bale has done nothing productive .
Dempsey playing well but Siggy & Hudd need to be sold .A chance today neither are taking ,can Hudd get any slower ? or is he just not that bothered ?
Hudd himself tweeted respect has to be earnt first ,practise what you preach

big cockeral

Need to seriously buck up in the second half, this is a mid- table Championship team and they look it!

Durbanspur

Not a very good performance at all. What's up with Caulker and Naughton today? Not there usual good selves. Hudd has no drive, Bale has been poor and where is Lennon today? This switching wings thing of AVB has to go. Bale's cross in the final third was very, very poor. We are making it easy for the leeds defence.

Fanman

Usual problem. Teams know they can sit back against us as we don't pose an attacking threat.

SpuriousLife

Both Bale and Lennon have been trying to take on the whole team on their own. A simple telling pass at the end will do....but no! Bale is showing too much arrogance. Caulker nervous. Hudds....well enough said!. Naughton and Benny OK. Sigg and Demps barely had a look in 'cos the wingers won't pass to either of them. Hope for a better 2nd half!. COYS!

Critical_Spur

friedel doesn't fill me with much confidence, and I hate that he always kicks pass backs long and gifts possession. caulker and naughton will need time to get used to each other. I understand the idea of playing bale and lennon on the other wings with the view that they cut in and provide more of a goal threat in the absence of an out and out striker, but it isn't working. dempsey is more likely to get on the end of a cross than defoe so lets play the wings and get the crosses in. not over yet but we need a big second half display

Guernman

Thank god we have a GSOH on here, this is one mother ****r of a painful game....get your money on spurs winning 3-1 or 4-1

spu 4 life

We are lucky not to be 2-0 down. Hudd and Siggy are very poor, and we have no one who can come in for them. We may have to bring on Dembele second half.

Fanman

Fanman +1 (again )

big cockeral

Critical_Spur, agreed. Bale has become too arrogant and selfish.

Fanman

THF- atmosphere sounds fine to me....Thud is slow but looks ok...Naughton caught out for the goal, whole back line too high, bale and lennon swapped on 24min not working, Dempsey missed free header, missed 1on1, too slow and can't hold the ball up...gylfi???....they need a real kick up the ass, Bale and lennon back to their wings, Dempsey hold the ball and gylfi get closer....

shedboy2

we need to level this in the first 15mins of the 2nd half and ten press on get DEMBELE on for hudd; give OBIKA a chance and play DEMPSEY IN Siggy's place.

spu 4 life

The going ain't easy without Dembele and Sandro. Would like to see Dembele on, but that only risks an injury. Wish Carroll was on't bench.

jacobslad

big cockeral, cheers! We'll need a big effort to turn this one around.

Fanman

Freidel slows everything up from the back, why are we playing the long ball game. Also, how slow was he shutting down the angle for their goal. Hudd is the main problem though. Doing SFA as usual, no transistion, no idea, no moving into space. Siggy is getting cramped up because of his pointless stationary movement. Still, I remain confident. We are good enough to turn this around. COYS. FOTH.

thenuge

How can Hudds Spurs career continue after this ? It`s these games where chances really need to be taken ,Siggy himself is average at best .Bad bad signing ,& an obvious one

big cockeral

Calm boys...the goal/s will come our way. What AVB can do to help is get Dembele on and swap the positions of Bale and Dempsey as Clint is no lone striker and Gareth may be able to score more directly.

bowerman

imo dembele for Thud would be a bad option...we'd have even less passing...dembele for Parker who's a tackle away from a booking perhaps...

shedboy2

Whenever Hudd is in CM we lose; except against West Ham. He doesn't close down the opposition, he doesn't run with the ball, he just passes the ball and sits or moves forward. He's frustrating to watch, as is Siggy.

Fanman

hudd was not bad...he made good passes...siggy was bit bad

Navaneeth

Levy, get the ******* cheque book out!

Fanman

fanman- you don't actually want Thud to run with the ball do you? it ain't rugby!

shedboy2

LENNON RIGHT !!!!!

BALE LEFT !!!!

Why undo good work all season by silly tactics that do not work ? Not even hard to spot by the untrained eye

big cockeral

That was how Rugby was invented ,someone picking up the football & running with it ,the rest was history

big cockeral

all down to siggy losing the phucking ball and one direct punt. well done

spu 4 life

All because of poor play by Siggy on the left ,,,
WHERE BALE SHOULD HAVE BEEN

big cockeral

might as well sign mcormack and stick him up front, shows more composure than any of our strikers...

rahn DMC

That's it! F@ck Friedel and Hudd!

dcruzer

siggy and donkey dempo donkeys, not good enough, now 2-0

tophobunty

here we go. let the bashing begin. I can almost see the upcoming posts...

logos8

big big cock up by AVB

123spurs

vertonghens havin a nightmare all game

ghulamville

Be lucky to get a reply.

T.H.F.Chris

Has Lennon touched the ball ,where the phuck has he gone ?

big cockeral

bale getting done by a little kid id FFS

123spurs

how can you blame siggy for the goal? his job is not to defend. we should be able to defend when an attacking player loses the ball

logos8

Dreadful from Caulker.

Fanman

WHAT A MISSSSSSSSSSSS DEMPSEY IS ******** USELESS

tophobunty

its just a reality call.

topspur53

that's why dempsey isn't an out and out forward

rahn DMC

fanman caulker is s donkey, lost to learn still

tophobunty

There he is ....Sorry Dempsey ,but when Lennon gives it to you on a plate like that you have to tuck it home .Great ball in ,more of that please lennon & Bale keep it simple

big cockeral

did bale travel? we are missing a world class player today

123spurs

You cannot start Livermore & Hudd in the team and exect anyting else but a loss... they shouk dbe trolley collectors for Tesco because they sure aren't footballers

Cape Town Spurs

Obika!!!

T.H.F.Chris

logos8 he gave the fing ball away when we had a chance to create something siggy is sheit

tophobunty

unbelievable , verts and caulker crap today , hudd is really bad , sigg fault for the goal lost the ball when a ll he had to do was cross it first time

ledleygomez

or maybe he is...

rahn DMC

Bale plays on the left!

Fanman

Bring both Siggy & Hudd off ,dreadful

big cockeral

clint u sweet boy

123spurs

goal dempsey

ledleygomez

siggy is sheit but the goal was not his fault.

logos8

Was as clear as daylight - they had to be replaced!

Durbanspur

really hope obika has a good game, still think he has a lot of potential

rahn DMC

GOAL GOAL GOAL

There you go Bale ,keep it simple ,great play by Bale .Show your quality by not over cooking it

big cockeral

logos8 Yes it was

big cockeral

logos 8 , he lost the ball down the right hand side when all he had to do was cross it , he arsed around with it and lost it , they scored from the clearance

ledleygomez

maybe we should strengthen the squad. remember someone else playing people out of position (demps)

topspur53

thank god lennon didnt take a corner like bale jut did

123spurs

was bale on the left then? and lennon on the right we he craeted that sitter for dempsey?

tophobunty

Isn't it funny that when you put Bale back on the left (where he's most effective) we create a chance and we score a goal...

rahn DMC

ha ha knew that would happen and bale was back on the left

topspur53

what the ***** was friedel doing then, come off your line sometimes brad

Guernman

Worst perfomance of the season. Absolutely woeful...

Fanman

Obika looks awful

tophobunty

C`mon Lennon wake up get in the game ffs

big cockeral

What has happened to us? We look terrible!

Fanman

Dempsey scores again

gRAMMSTEIN

I was afraid of this. The MotM today has been Adebayor. He absence was more than the presence of anyone who has been on the pitch. Of course, he would have fit right in with today's performance if he'd been there.

Total knobhead

No excuses, we've been poor but this ref is calling fouls on us that aren't , and refusing to blow the whistle when they mug us

shidyid

BIGC Lennon has been a "good" as Bale today, which makes a change because for the vast majority of games this season he has been better

tophobunty

sadly BAE has been awful today, not alone though

tophobunty

If this doesn`t make Levy get his cheque book out nothing will

big cockeral

we need a play-maker desperately.

Fanman

The two Kyles? Ouch today.

Total knobhead

Our squad is not good enough!We could really do with a couple of more players!

SilwalYid

I like BAE but i agree ,been dreadful .lucky to get 4/10

big cockeral

bale stop the flashy cross an do the simpe thing

123spurs

Not a bad idea to bring in that lad from Germany right now.

Total knobhead

what a chance to make a name for urself

123spurs

P**s poor defending cost us today.

Fanman

I can't believe how poor we were today, what happened?

Fanman

Obika dwelled on the ball everytime he had it, not good enough for us at all.

Fanman

2nd goal what awful defending by Caulker...el donkeoni

tophobunty

Caulker has been absolute rubbish today, Verts has also been poor, Naughton too!

Fanman

phucking shi7 got what we deserved.

spu 4 life

We have to pick ourselves up and go to Norwich on Wednesday. Naughton or Caulker to be dropped. I never thought that I'd be glad to see Walker.

Fanman

Utter disgrace!

dcruzer

We really sucked,didnt we?? :(

SilwalYid

We really sucked,didnt we?? :(

SilwalYid

I meant to write out and ouch about the two Kyles. And Caulker was ouch, too.

And our midfield was molasses. Pure treacle, with no through movement. Worst showing of the AVB era. Ghosts of HR.

Total knobhead

Wish Levy could just dump Hudd, Naughton, Bentley, JJ, and any youngster not good enough....We need to buy quality and not keep average quantity.

dcruzer

Not a bad idea to bring in that lad from Germany right now. Total knobhead - on that showing a few more would not go a miss.

spu 4 life

What a poor performance, absolutely dreadful. Only Parker played well. The rest were clueless.

Fanman

We really sucked,didnt we?? :(

SilwalYid

that was sickening to watch, OBIKA can ***** off not fit to wear the shirt

E17YID

What happened to Vertonghen today?

Fanman

Well done Leeds .

Hudd ,BAE ,Siggy ,Lennon & Obika were shocking today .No excuse for that ,complete $hit & got done by crap like Brown & Diouf .
,br>Levy open the cheque book because it`s going to start falling at your door

big cockeral

Naughton didnt do ***** all wrong vert was worst than him dcruzer, Dempsey *****e bale lennon *****e ... Hudds should of been off after 15 mins

E17YID

top-2nd goal was Verts fault...he didn't even run to cover his mistake...worse game I've seen him play, like a pub player...

shedboy2

now MR LEVY CAN YOU SEE HOW MUCH WE ARE IN NEED OF A STRIKER!!!!!!!!!anyway lets get on with the league(sickened)

krafty007

Can't believe we've been knocked out by Leeds. Also Obika was the only striker available to "save us" off the bench, disgraceful.

Guyver

the whole team was a disgrace, I think that team needs shooting

E17YID

Adebayor Man of the Match because his not showing up was better than those who showed up.

Total knobhead

Verts was our worst player today....Parker was a headless chicken and it doesn't bode well as a partnership with Dembele- zero creativity.

shedboy2

well we all had a good laugh at harry now who,s laughing , this has nothing to do with levy or avb , the players ( bar parker ) are to blame for this game , they should hang there heads in shame , disgusting performance .

ledleygomez

AVB got it wrong for me and should have played his strongest 11!!! No defoe, Walker or Dembele?? I think he underestimated Leeds today and we payed the price for it. As for the players - All 11 were poor today. Lets draw a line underneath it and move on!!!!

woodyn17

Obika, was crap, I am sickened by that striker was of space.

E17YID

Well done Leeds, have to say they were better than us. Bad defending but without a striker we looked weak, imagine that team playing in the champions league, nah. We ain't going to be top 4 unless we get a new forward or Defoe starts banging them in again. S hit!

T.H.F.Chris

Big C - How the feck was Obika useless??? The defender put in a world class block. Knee jerk reaction!!!

woodyn17

we scored 1 goal off a shoulder...dempsey ain't a striker, and Obika is not up to scratch...

shedboy2

First Norwich ,now Leeds

Our squad needs vamping up .

big cockeral

I agree that Vertonghen was poor today. No one played well. No one. Should have played Gomes. Might as well have played 10 men including Gomes.

Total knobhead

Woodyn17, AVB didnt get it wrong the players let him down ... defending was shocking caulker needs to go back out on loan and learn to defend very poor from him very poor

E17YID

oldham 1-0 up 70sec

E17YID

E17YID, agreed. Obika is just terrible, how long does he want on the ball? We desperately need to buy some players. Levy leaving things late has now knocked us out of the cup. If we got a striker and play-maker in early, we'd be ok. That performance was up there with the Wigan one. Dreadful. Siggy has to go. Hopefully (can't believe I'm saying this) Defoe is fit to start against Norwich. Levy has f'd us up. How can he be so complacent? Liverpool needed a striker, they got Sturridge in early. Every team that needed a striker got one except us, even Swansea. I'm furious right now.

Fanman

well well. the first time we played verts, caulker and naughton i think, and they lacked an older presence. gallas perhaps still has a role to play. disappointing display from caulker. friedel really is a liability, not only can he simply not dive anymore, his constant long balls just invite pressure, whereas lloris hardly ever goes long. if we now go out and buy a striker, then this could prove a good result for us. not too too bothered though, i think united want this cup badly this year, perhaps fergie wants to retire on a high, but in any case we have hihglighted some big squad weaknesses with four days to go in the window. now norwich away is a really big game.

Guernman

ledleygomez- really excusing Parker??? sorry for me he was poor....rash tackling, no creativity and doing hook turns instead of passing....running around doesn't make a good game...

shedboy2

At least Liverpool have gone behind in the first seconds of their match.

Total knobhead

Defence was a shambles. Simple as that. Leeds played with more determination going forward than us defending. Lloris back in goal everything will be allright. Jan had a nightmare of a game, he needs EPL pitches, the goat tracks don't help his game. So dissapointed, because of all the cups, I thought we could win this one. Watch Leeds get drawn with Luton or MK Dons to rub it in.

thenuge

E17YID - you cannot start the game without 1 recognised striker (Dempsey is no striker). Caulker has been great this season and had an off day.

woodyn17

The thing is Norwich are a team similar to leeds. Guys like Pilkington and Holt run and pressure you like leeds did ,all day long. Our defence was terrible today, people slate gallas but he organizes the backline, today it was disjointed to say the least.

spurfect one

Fanman, I agree 100% with your statement but we all know Levy leaves everything to last Minute!

E17YID

Today's game showed the players we definitely can do without. I don't often do this but player like Hudd just doesn't cut it, no fire, no real quality. He needs to be sold this window. Sorry just my opinion. Leeds were up for the game and we treated them like a second division team and more than that with disdain. Our players just never seem to play with pride and cojones, except for a few. We still have a lot of weeding to do. Pitiful defensive play from players I would never have expected to play so poorly, especially in such an important game. Really upset right now.

jvd

the pitch was crap, the ball was to round, it all goes against us, not enough added time, Norwich next then happy thursday at the training ground for last minute bargain buys

spu 4 life

Parker & Lennon do get far too much protection . Both way below par today ,way below

big cockeral

Woody, who is at fault for no striker AVB if it is true he rested Defoe, but please Obika as a striker ... player 100 senior games for leauge 1 & 2 teams not good enough! Siggy should not of been taken off at all Dembele was poor oh well FA cup over for next year at least we can look forward to Gary Hooper huh

E17YID

Caulker had a woeful game. He is a lot better than that and obviously so is the team. Beat Norwich and we will be back on track. We may be able to put out a very good first team, but as always our squad is not cut out for too many competitions yet, and CL is the main focus. Now it's all about the CL and Europa.

asherthesmasher

BAE is not in game shape. Vertonghen is not in game shape. Parker is barely there. Hudd was not in game shape. Caulker was terrible. Naughton was not great but was starting to develop something with Lennon in the second half and then was removed. I would never have brought on Walker. People blame Obika. For what. He's had no game time and he was supposed to be 100% up to speed and to know what everyone around him was doing. Ridiculous. He made a couple of good runs and almost got on the end of it. What did Sigurdsson do? Lennon created about 5 scoring chances. We need a striker. Friedel will always concede. We always needed to score at least 2. Dembele looked ok. Bale on the off wing was terrible. Why do we do that as a strategy?

Anyway, to jump all over Obika is ridiculous. There were many senior players who were worse. Loose passes by Parker, Dembele, Vertonghen, BAE were much more of a concern for me. COYS

peterballb

Obika, our only striking option off the bench. Terrible. I thought that Parker was our only player with a clue, dreadful!

Fanman

so if you any of you actually give a damn email the club... make your voices heard... vote with your wallets and your words... if we do not Levy will asset strip as has been going on since 2008.

Cape Town Spurs

bad very bad

papsy

Ask Schalke if they would exchange siggy for holtby?

spu 4 life

shedboy , i know what your saying but at least he played with pride , i dont mind losing ( even to leeds ) but for christ sake play for the fans and the shirt , we think were a big team and turned up expecting to win we were wrong , even man u show respect to a lesser team we dont

ledleygomez

Well I hope all of you who called for the team that started today are happy because you got what you asked for and the team got what it deserved. We are not strong enough in depth to beat a championship outfit, how some of you mugs think we're strong enough to finish in the top 4 baffles me. Dempsey is a mid table striker and I've seen oil tankers turn quicker. Siggy isn't ready yet and to be honest he may never be. Our lack of creativity is embarrassing and our options up front are non existent. Vertonghen was a shadow of the player we saw earlier this season, maybe he was promised world class players would join him in the coming transfer windows? Walker, for all his faults is a better RB than Naughton, who is decent back up for both our full backs. Fair play to Leeds though, they wanted it more and probably deserved the result. Might be a blessing in disguise if it forces Levy to dip into his pocket.

thfc1882whl

The team that gave the most effort won. They put pressure on every ball, and as seems the case every time Friedel is in the net, we seem to not be bothered about keeping possession and keeping the ball on the ground. Our guys just didn't give it today. Simple as that. Too fancy. Nowhere near direct enough. COYS

peterballb

Terrible defensively today. No idea between Caulker and Verts. They obviously had no faith in Friedel behind them. Caulker was truly terrible today. We got beaten by two direct punts downfield. That sort of stuff school boys should be able to defend against. The second goal went through Friedel's hands. As usual we threatened so little up front against a side who are a division and a bit below us. Very, very poor. Well done Leeds but we helped them as much as they helped themselves. Our need for a striker is now beyond embarrassing. With what we've got we don't ever look like scoring more than 1 goal in any game we play in. That isn't good enough to do anything in the second half of the season. Hopefully Levy was watching today. Come on Levy - longer arms and shorter pockets instead of vice-versa.

SpuriousLife

For me, 100% of the blame lies with Levy. Why have we struggled the whole window to bring in Holtby? Apparently over a small fee too. My elderly Grandfather could pay Holtby's transfer fee if he wanted to. Players like Holtby and that elusive striker (Only elusive if you believe the board are actually trying to buy one) are ABSOLUTE NECESSITIES for our squad, they aren't on some magical unrealistic football manager wishlist. All I am asking for is sensible, efficient, prompt, and intelligent investment to help us on the PITCH. Having a new signing or two on the pitch today most likely would have got us through.

BlackStar Spur

If ever we needed Sandro, it was today...

Fanman

So people who wanted Dempsey,Siggi partnership got what they want and Who wanted Obika to play also got what they wished for.We were plain terrible.No excuses!It doesnt hurt much as long as the scums go all the way and win it!

SilwalYid

There is only one man to blame for this terrible performance, the manager who picked the team. Why change the defence so radically? Naughton and Caulker haven't played together and neither have Verts and BAE. They all looked like they'd never met before and no Lloris to back them up. Disappointing attack but the failure was in defence no question.

Love totty

Levy wouldn't bail himself out of jail so don't hold your breath expecting him to spend a cent on us -- he is an asset stripper masquerading as a Spurs supporter. Anyhow, thing we have a solid squad, no need for additions. We're good up front, have cover on the flanks, ample GK's should 2 get injured, and we've got Tom Huddlestone, the human ice cream;

Cape Town Spurs

I agree peterballb except i was happy to see Walker on. Let's move on. I won't lose any sleep over that game. we do need a striker big time. I think the fact that we have Ade to come back and the amount we pay him, is probably the main reason we won't end up with a Dimiao etc, this window.

asherthesmasher

History shows Levy does most of his business on the final hour of deadline day hunting for bargain buys, saha and nelson for example, god i'm depressed

spurfect one

Maybe AVB needs to play a settled centre back partnership
I don`t believe for a minute the Vertonghen & caulker are that bad .I rate both of them but to be that dreadful ? they have to click & clearly did not today . Nothing clicked today & a team of individuals is $hit compared to a team of unity .

NO I IN T.E.A.M .Levy get spending because 4th will be gone .Too many square pegs in round holes ,attacking winger ,striker & playmaker is need ,not a want .

The bench is shocking when you need a goal or creativity

big cockeral

2012-2013 no 2013-2014 no 2014-2015 no 2015-2016 no 2016-2017 no 2017-2018 no 2018-2019 no 2019-2020 n0 2020-2021 YES the year ends in a one Not long to go and we win the FA CUP. I will only be 136yrs old lol

spu 4 life

Parker wasn't good either, no matter that a couple of people thought he was. He was like a headless chicken on the pitch, not like a cockerel. More banty foul than banty fowl.

Total knobhead

E17YID- of course AVB got it wrong, we lost. He picked the team - left Bale and Lennon on the wrong wings for too long, he left parker in the middle when we needed creativty to win the game not a destroyer to defend it, he played Caulker at RCB for the first time (I'd have done the same) and instructed the back 4 to push up...now I'm not calling for anything, sometimes you lose as long as we learn the lessons and get the balance right for the next game...and buy a striker we'll be OK.

shedboy2

wow people very critical of obika didn t do much wrong it was a greag tackle/block----we was ***** on the day but its not his fault, our two central defenders were rubbish and the rest of the team were all below par, that does not mean we have suddenly become a ***** team or we should sell half of our squad, it might be a blessing in disguise because that 4th spot is our priority and we aint no shoe in for that either---------STRIKER REQUIRED BETTER THAN MINIMUM WAGE PAID(just)

krafty007

CapeTownSpurs, lament the lack of a real striker, fine. But asset stripping? Get a grip. Our players are amongst the best paid in the PL. OK we can't compete with City, Chelsea, ManU, Liverpool and Arsenal for obvious reasons. The lads played poorly today. I would have started Dawson. Caulker who hasn't really played much recently beside Vertonghen, who has been off ill, beside BAE who is coming off of injury and with Naughton on the right when he has played on the left most of the year. This, to me, is down to lack of heart but the defensive errors are all down to AVB. What was put in front of Friedel was exactly what we always saw in front of Gomes. A different setup with guys who just haven't been playing together. One change, fine, but a wholly changed back 5? Shocking. COYS

peterballb

For me all of the blame lies with Levy. We have no idea what to do with the ball in the final third. All we can do is get it wide and cross it in. Our striker situation is embarrasing. This is our best chance to finish even third, and Levy isn't buying the players that we need. I just can't believe how poor Caulker and Vertonghen were today? Obika from the bench of a top 4 team? No feckin way!

Fanman

Ah well that's another trophy we won't win. Out of the CC at Norwich, out of the FA Cup at Leeds Utd, but on't worry we are all right with what we have, no need for additions, this current team can walk on water, if you listen to AVB and Levy. It wouldn't be so bad if we were getting knocked out by big clubs, but apparently we can't even beat the dross. It just drives you to despair, we are ruining our season for the sake of a few quid. Cheers Mr. Levy.

Frank

if there is a MOTM poll I suggest no-one votes, becuase everyone was pathetic and no-one deserves even a mention, a smack around the chops and kick up the ar$e, yes, but not a mention

Cape Town Spurs

friedel coming up for a corner Gomes is much better in the air why did he not play up front, BIG C that's the point look at the bench full of goalscorers, shocking for a club as big as we are.

spu 4 life

AVB claiming we have strength in depth and looking embarrassed as he said it. Also said Holtby probably won't be coming either, still it'll save the board some cash eh! COYS FOENIC ILIDNT

thfc1882whl

Parker looks so unfit and is a shadow of the player he was last year. Hes not an attacking midfielder so why all of a sudden does he go bursting forward when he physically cant get back?! I would much prefer him to sit infront of the defense and come 2 life when were endangered. Really think that not only a striker is a MUST another DM is aswell. Momo Diame would be the best bet, hes a powerhouse and is certainly better then parker atm. This result could be a blessing in disguise and could force us 2 spend, but unfortunately I highly doubt that now; all of our striker targets that fit the bill of young rising talent are no longer available ie pato and remy. The other 'older strikers' we could of got 4 cheap like ba, llorente and huntelaar are also unavailable now. Lets face it levy is not going 2 spend 15m on soldado or negredo who are both 27...we'll probz end up with gary hooper, *sigh* the life of a spurs fan!

SpursSnM

How are we to believe that AVB is the new Messiah and deserves to be backed financially when he cocks up like this? He weakened the GK, the defence, the midfield and the attack all in one game. BRAINLESS.

Love totty

I've just heard the same rumour from a couple of different sources that Defoe is injured and may be out for a fortnight. Apparently nothing is being said until after the end of the transfer window just in case our illustrious owners decide we may need a striker. After Thursday the extent of Defoe's injury should be announced. Bloody great!

SpuriousLife

PeterB, argue with me in 3-5 years when our assets have been replaced by somewhat lesser assets and the profit invested in Ambre Solaire. I like you, you are an intelligent poster, but then answer me this.. 31 Aug, 23H59, Mouthini to Spurs for a reported 24 bar... the top brass had no idea there was 3rd party ownership... let's pretend we believe their lies... where has the 23 bar gone since the window has been closed and as such why is the only striker we can afford related to Arthur Scargill? I'll listen on the radio

Cape Town Spurs

ledleygomez- you're right about them turning up expecting to win...the worst culprit for me was bale who was lazy off the ball...

shedboy2

parker huddlestone livermore are not good enough in the middle, sandro as solid as he is cant play football and dembele is best behind striker. centre midfielder aka moutinho asap

redknappslayer

parker huddlestone livermore are not good enough in the middle, sandro as solid as he is cant play football and dembele is best behind striker. centre midfielder aka moutinho asap

redknappslayer

thfc1882whl- It baffles you how some of us think we can finish fourth when we are actually sitting in fourth? On top of that, the people that take bets, the ones that really have to know there stuff, think we are slight favorites. Baffling comments by you thfc1882whl. The mentality seemed to be wrong today. Fitness was a factor. Eight out of ten times we would beet Leeds. That's football. We didn't turn up mentally, and two or three players seemed to be off pace. That's football. get over it.

asherthesmasher

and forgive my typos and loss of a million quid in a key stoke!

Cape Town Spurs

Levy, buy a bleeding striker, S T R I K E R..........................

micky58

Love totty - we need to rotate the squad and team to keep the squad fresh for the season. Last season should have been proof enough for you of what happens later in the season if you don't rotate.

SpuriousLife

asher, no way do I bring on Walker after those two great passes by Naughton to Lennon. That's what we have been missing. Look, first goal was down to lack of communication. Caulker needs to work on this. He's had an issue with Friedel, with Lloris and now with Naughton. He needs to be better. All three have wound up in the back of the net. 2nd goal, loose pass and really no cover. We weren't sharp. I really thought Parker, Vertonghen, Caulker, Dembele, BAE were all awful. You can't win games when that many players don't show up. OK, Dempsey is not a striker. He has 6 goals in his last 8 appearances scoring in 5. Defoe has 1 in 8. Honestly folks. What I expect of a striker is that if they are given 90 minutes, they will bag one, more often than not. He does that. Defoe never has, in all of his career. We need a revamp of the strikers. If not now, then in the summer. COYS

peterballb

shows what a difference Sandro and Lloris make

ledders77

bet levy cant wait for the window to close.no striker, for 4th place

topspur53

BTW- I do think we are real need of one or two players, especially a striker now! I do think we can qualify for CL as is, but equally i think we can miss out. I thinks it's 50/50. Levy, do something FFS!.

asherthesmasher

redknappslayer- I think all 3 of them are good enough to play in the middle, just not with each other, i also think Sandro is a better ball player than you give him credit for and Dembele has been moved further back as he plays better there,,,,apart from that I agree with everything you say...;)

shedboy2

Striker option Obika, if it wasn't as tragic it would be funny. Does our DOF, come chairman realise the state our squad is in. If we try to rest any first X1 player we are in trouble, we are even reduced to giving the likes of Huddlestone game time. Sigurdson is an example of an impulse signing on a stupid contract, how do we shift him, lets be fair what has he done, 5 minutes loan at Reading, a few games at Swansea, then we nick him of Rodgers why? he ain't good enough. We are supposed to be a top 4 club for Christ's sake, at least for now. Hopefully this disgrace of a result should serve as an eye opener, we are not a quarter as good as we think we are. If after our CC and FAC results, we fail to finish top 4 an qualify for the CL, there should be a massive "Levy out" campaign at WHL, his time will be up.

Frank

No worries though. The fixture list just got better. Let's get that 4th and turn a few heads in Europe now...

ledders77

Peter- the first goal was down to Naughton getting caught out, the 2nd was down to Verts getting caught out on both occasions Caulker was the covering player....now he didn't have a good game at RCB and could have done better but he can't be singled out for the goals....

shedboy2

Frank, for once I agree. Our squad is wafer thin. The finger needs to be pointed directly at Levy. Buying Sigurdsson was a mistake.

Fanman

Frank

I hope you`re not right why does it take us to be knocked out of a cup before a solution is found ? embarrassing

iIf Levy don`t sign at least 2 players ,Frank will get a few more friends

big cockeral

Hear! Hear!!

Naijagunner

I like Dempsey, i think he will give us enough for the rest of the season as a midfielder. He isn't a striker. We need a bloody striker. I am already starting to thing that Siggy is not going to cut it. I am open minded, would love o be proved wrong. If we can get Holtby in, Siggy may not even make the bench.

asherthesmasher

Mmmwahahahahhahahahhahahahahaha!

Naijagunner

i think todasy shows a number of things, mainly how short we are in midfield...we all know this issues up front. Dempsey and Siggy just not good enough and Caulker only just getting up on par with the 79 year old Galles,

tophobunty

Greatest song for Spurs fans ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wp43OdtAAkM

big cockeral

I think Sigurdsson gave the ball away for both conceded goals. Wasnt happy that we signed him as I felt even Kranc is a better player, half way through the season and so far he's done worse than I feared.

Guyver

Frank + 1. With the current squad we will not finish in the top 4 this season. Anyone who thinks we will is deluded. To have any chance we need Holtby in now and a proper striker. Anything less and I'll be surprised if we finish in the top 6. Levy and his cronies can see it too. If they do nothing then it is nothing short of dereliction of duty.

SpuriousLife

asher, Lawro predicted a draw but for the poor play of Leeds of late coupled with our consistently good form, otherwise he would have taken Leeds to win. We didn't show up. And thus, as you say, slight favourites, away, at a tough park, and we lost. They wanted it more and our guys played in fits and starts when they could be bothered. Honestly, 55M for Bale to bring in Willian, Negredo, Son, Dzagoev, Holtby would seem a decent move. Bale does not help much defensively and his lack of backside pressure causes issues.

CapeTownSpurs, there is no evidence whatsoever that there is any asset stripping. That ENIC will not spend transfer fees and wages above what is affordable is not stripping of assets. The manager wanted Moutinho. No doubt the third party ownership was known about, but it's not like you'd sort them out before you agree a fee with the club and the player, now is it? Modric needed to be sold first. I don't think Moutinho was ever likely to get done. He traveled with the club. He wasn't expecting it. A month later he was talking about his desire to play for Juve etc. Come on. Moutinho was not what we needed today. A real striker with a presence and a true playmaker. Holtby might be one of those two cogs. But then, we still lack the one element necessary. Dempsey is fine, in a 4-4-2 setup. He just needs someone to work off of. So will Holtby. See where the problem is yet.

And if we'd signed Moutinho for the 26M, we'd be about 30M in the hole, not counting salaries. OK, we could have sold Hudd. So we'd only be about 26M in the hole. Who were you planning on selling that would generate that revenue? COYS

peterballb

Cape Town maybe had it right. Calling Levy an asset stripper sounds very harsh, but I feel that with the sales in recent times of Modric and VDV and then to replace them with Dempsey and Sigurdsson who have hardly proven any REAL quality this season might suggest that he is right.

BlackStar Spur

all the calls for Holtby...imo he's Jamie O hara level, no more, a great 'Free' and he may train on but a if we're serious about top4 we need quality players for the now...but I'm not sure we are serious.

shedboy2

i think we should start the Levy out campaign now... it may be the only way to get anything done. i find it sad that i typed those words, because Levy has done good, bit deep down I know he cares only about the money and will lie cheat and steal if it'll make it an extra 50p. That is sad

Cape Town Spurs

How poor was Hudd? We badly miss Sandro. Verts and Caulker, never again please. Caulker doesn't seem to bright. The wat the Leeds player lost him was ridiculous. That was Verts worst game for us. I didn't think that he could play so poorly.

Fanman

Shedboy - Hotby is a German international. He is miles better than O'Hara. Miles better. Give him a few games to settle and then you'll see. However he still needs a striker to pass to, create spaces and chances for, work off to score goals. Do we have one of those at Spurs. Defoe it isn't. Last season's Adebayor would have been good but this season's one is making Gregor Raziak look world class.

SpuriousLife

Peter- your sums always add up to zero...where's the anual transfer budget? As for wages as Freund said before we played this match..we have a salary structure....that means we are not paying out significantly anymore in wages now then we were a few years ago when we had the structure...It's a ratio....our salaries will and always should go up!!

shedboy2

Wentworths love for Pav, is the same as my love for Hudd. I blame the entire result on him.

thenuge

peter- not sure why you are telling me what Lawro predicted. Had we turned up today, we would have won, but unlike most of our away matches in the prem this season, we didn't turn up. Our defense lost us the game anyway and as you say peter, perhaps too much change by AVB was the reason why. Anyway, we are sitting fourth in the prem, still slight favorites for fourth, let's keep that way by beating Norwich.

asherthesmasher

I have to say I'm all for rotation higher up the pitch but not the centre backs and goalkeeper. I feel had we played Dawson and caulker today with Lloris we probably wouldn't have looked so shoddy in defence.

Jantheman

Didn't see the game, but think that it was too early to play Verts after his illness. There are no excuses when you lose to a lower league team. No excuses! If Levy and AVB are stupid enough to think our squad is good enoug then something is seriously wrong. Deja vu creeping in from last season.

Jables

@Peter -- Levy had us all believing we were signing Mouthino -- it was AVB's No1 choice -- he sold our 2 creative and attacking MF's -- there was alleged surprise at the 11th hour (which none of us buy into, we're not that wet behind the ears), and now suddenly the money ear marked no longer exists. Personally I could not give a damn whether we sign Mouthino but I do give a damn that our club has been selling it's top assets since 2008 and to date has not replaced one with even an attempt for like for like quality.

Cape Town Spurs

To describe what has happened at Spurs in the last 4 years as asset stripping is absolutely accurate. Michael Carrick and Dimitar Berbatov were sold for big money, Berbatov has not been replaced by any quality option, Luka Modric and Raphael Van Der Vaart are sold, for big money in the case of Modric, neither has been properly replaced, we have signed journeymen. To dramatically reduce the quality of the team, to cash in on the quality players, to fail to replace them with similar quality players, instead trousering the money, what else can you describe it as but asset stripping, it is a classic example. Perhaps it's "running a tight ship", "saving up for a new stadium" or simply failing to understand the consequences of certain actions, what it definitely isn't is the way to run what should be a competitive football club, but silly me I forgot that is not the intention, it is just an exercise in insuring the appreciating value of a property investment, that just happens to be a football club. The ENIC, Lewis, Levy exercise at WHL has got nothing to do with football, it's about future profit. The biggest tragedy is that many are so blind they cannot see the club being raped. The transfer winddow has been open for 4 ddays short of a month during which our "striker" has gone to the ACN, our best DMFer gets injured and is out for the season, we have scraped 2 draws scoring 1 goal in 180 minutes an now have been knocked oput of the FA Cup, has this stimulated any action by our transfer genius, of course not, even if he pulls off some sroke for a third rater on dead line out, the horse has already bolted Levy we have dropped 4 league points and are out of the cup, you have played a blinder yet again, for the 8th window at least. No doubt we will "agree a fee for some world class striker" at 23.30 on 31st Jan, only not to be able to get it one in time, shades of Moutinho.

Frank

Truly awful performance defensively. Naughton, Caulker, Verts and BAE all dreadful. Friedel also dreadful, especially his distribution. I don't see the point in rotating the GK's anyway, and would rather see a steady partnership in CD. Up front, well what can you say? Just no penetration at all. Dempsey's goal came from nothing really, I couldn't believe it when it actually went in. Hudd, just terrible. It's absolutely ridiculous that we as a club can start a game without a recognised senior striker not on the pitch or the bench. If we don't buy one this Jan then we are not going to finish top 4. Feel a bit for Obika, he didn't do much wrong, but blew his big moment, a real quality striker probably would have taken that first time. Anyway, looking forward to Thursday now to see what drama unfolds at the end of the TF window. Maybe we will get Robbie Keane back on loan, third time is a charm, he got 19 goals in the MLS this year, so he is in hot form!!!!!.

Cleveland ARTSPURS

At least the poll is easy ..... Lets just blame AVB or Levy!

big cockeral

Guyver, with Sigurdsson and Hudd on the field, we may aswell start with 9 men. tophobunty, I disagree with you on Dempsey. I think that he works hard and is very useful. He was our only decent player today. Just gutted that Sandro is out. If Defoe is injured we are fecked. He must be injured or he would of featured today.

Fanman

Hudd's gone back to drinking bottles of Heinz Ketchup, he looks heavier than ever. I rate his technical ability, but his physique is more Sumo Wrestler than premiership footballer.

Guyver

SpuriousLife- hope you're right, Ohara was/is a decent player (engalnd u21 international) but I saw Holtby play a few times before we were linked and he didn't stand out....in his last game 2 assists and a goal still didn't fill me full of confidence in the performance.

shedboy2

asherthsmasher....... Sitting 4th and finishing 4th are two completely different things mate. If you seriously believe that we have the required strength in depth then that's your perogative, personally, I don't. As for the bookies, if we finish this window with no additions then watch our odds on 4th lengthen by the week.

thfc1882whl

thfc1882whl That must have pained you to say something so obvious ,& it needed spelling out

big cockeral

you can't blame it all on thud thenuge...at least he was on the pitch when we scored our only goal...our 3 substitutes didn't have any affect.

shedboy2

Our defense was poor, but I thought that BAE was the best of a poor bunch. At least he managed to track back when he made a mistake, and looked dangerous when attacking. Levy has to hang his head in shame really. How can the club sitting 4th in the EPL not have a recognised striker on our books. I've never seen such a dire situation. Levy screwed us at the start of the season, and he's screwed us again at the start of the second half. In all the furore, I've forgetten about Ade. He better come back with some form! Not that he would of done anything today though. Maybe he would of held up the ball!

Fanman

shedboy2- Shabby arsed opinions. They should be a wage structure in place for any club who has to budget. But i guarantee our structure on wages is a looser one that the one we had two or three seasons ago. We are making more money get losing money. It does not take a genius to work it out. As for Holtby/O'hara. Please! Holtby is a technically gifted player. that say enough already when comparing him with O'hara.

asherthesmasher

sorry, *not have a recognised striker on the bench*

Fanman

On the train back from the game now, can't believe how bad Verts was today. He and Caulker were given the run around by McCormack. Tom Hudestone and Siggy looked poor too. I thought Bale and Lennon were our best players but maybe I'm wrong. My god though what do we expect with our strike force. We need A BLOODY STRIKER. COYS

HuddersfieldYiddo

3-1 oldham

ledleygomez

look on the bright side Arse are just starting to gel and Liverpool with Sturridge are looking more dangerous and playing well....but they both can't win next in the league..;)

shedboy2

peterballb...... Now I know you're going to reel off loads of stats that prove that Dempsey is the new messiah, even though the evidence of our own eyes points to the opposite. Granted he's got a little better and he pops up in the right place at the right time, usually because he's to slow to get into the box until the rebound appears. But he is never going to be the answer to our whole host of problems, I realise that, much like Levy, you prefer to work with stats rather than your eyes but trust me mate, the 'Moneyball' approach will never work with football.

thfc1882whl

oldham3-1 up

topspur53

Frank, I'm with you brotha!

Cape Town Spurs

thfc1882whl- that depends what Everton and arsenal do in the market, don't you think. Everton will fade anyway. We have looks more consistent than Arsenal. I think we have better players than them. So therefor, unless they buy one or two outstanding players, i do think we can finish above them, as is. Does not mean i don't think we should strengthen, because i do.

asherthesmasher

thfc1882whl is coming on here smashing it ,holy $hit lock up your daughters ,bad boy in town

big cockeral

some serious over reactions here. we had a bad day at a very tough away ground. we didn't have a striker. obika was not bad at all, i have seen defoe make less of a contribution plenty of times. yes he hung on to the ball, it was his chance to impress and he probably tried a bit too hard, the boy has got pace though. siggy was very disappointing, dempsey worked hard and got his goal. it was the first time this defence played together and they didn't gel. they are young and very talented though. friedel remains a liability who won't come off his line. we were very unlucky with the first goal, the high line worked only their player didn't touch the ball when he tried too, it was bad luck. lloris would have been off his line in a shot and would have made it much harder to score. naughton was the first RB to play a decent pass to lennon since corluka, that showed promise, I hope that the introduction of walker is not an indication that we will see less of naughton in that position. Bale should have done more, and I dislike the switching wings, especially when they had very young full backs to exploit and dempsey is likely to get on the end of crosses as he showed with the goal. if this result means we bring in a striker then great

Guernman

Guess we can all take consolation in the fact that Liverpoo are looking even worse than we did today

thfc1882whl

sorry Pool playing well in the league!....hopefully the myth that football is all about possession will get exposed soon....

shedboy2

asher... Everton fade? Isn't their problem that they usually start the season poorly and finish it strongly? As for the nomads, they always come on strong towards the end of the season and they have 15 years of qualifying under their belts, plus, what if they go on and win the CL. What good is 4th then?

thfc1882whl

Shedboy, you might want to check your numbers on that one. Our salaries have been steadily increasing. They have been for about 5 years, where we have gone from a top end of salary structure being around 65k to now over 100k. I would suggest to you that all of Bale, Lennon, Defoe, Ade, Parker, Dembele, Vertonghen, Dempsey, Lloris are all beyond our previous cap. 2009, our wages were 50M, 2010 were 67M, 2011 they were over 90M and I have not yet seen those for last season and do not know about this year. Modric was being payed poorly as he refused to redo his salary. VDV would have been up there, King too perhaps.

Frank, if selling a tapped up player for beyond the market value is considered asset stripping, then all teams do it. I'd sell Bale for 55M in a heartbeat. He is not worth it, even to us. Tell me one of those players you mention who would have stayed if a better wage packet were provided? NOT A STINKIN ONE. They all wanted out. 2 refused outright to play. Make up whatever fiction you want, Levy got his price for all of them and each team overpaid. COYS

peterballb

I want to defend Dempsey. He isn't world class but he is a good footballer. He isn't a striker, his strength is playing behind the striker where his intelligence and ability to play a pass is key. He scores a few from there too. He will never be good enough to play as a lone striker. Look at it this way at the moment he is the ONLY goal threat we have. If that isn't a very sad state of affairs then nothing is.

SpuriousLife

And lets not write off Liverpool ,they are fixing issues & have the best in league imo .Suarez is unstoppable ,add to him & you have a top 4 team

big cockeral

Peterbalb, please can we not harp on about annual losses, the value of the club having risen by Christ knows how much since 2007, so what, fans aren't, or at least shouldn't be, interested in such things, we want REASONABLE investment in the required players for the team to realise it's potential, see of our rivals and qualify for the CL year on year. If Lewis/Levy can't or won't deliver that, then they should sell up, foxtrot oscar, and let's have somebody with a modicum of interest in football, and the ambition to push forward, take over.

Frank

Oh dear a chance for Naughton,Hudd and Obika to show what they can do and they were absolute cr*p.We had absolutely nothing up front (as per usual).Bale and Lennon will be off unless we can get a STRIKER (Levy yes a striker) to put some of these crosses away.We were woeful today...cannot believe Caulker and Verts were so bad.Was Levy even watching?? Time to ship out Hudd,Bentley, Jenas, Obika, Kane, Gallas,Friedel and move on.

wentworth

spot on FRANK says it all, will we get a striker? NO we wont, if arsenal and liverpool overtake us, it will be down to their ambition. Shame levy and co dont have any. What AVB must be thinking, god only knows. He has had no backing what so ever.

topspur53

no we cant we gotta deal with our own mess

ghulamville

asherthesmasher- shabby arsed opinions???.... we do have a wage structure we pay out a percentage of our turnover on wages....that may have crept up by what 2%??? so where's the shabby? as for Holtby let's wait and see...and Ohara is a technically good player, the creative force that kept wolves up the year before last, a player I would have kept but not one to take us on a level.....

shedboy2

agreed spuriouslife, dempsey scores important goals and I doubt he is a pleasure to play against. he reads the game very well and lets his presence be known out there

Guernman

Peterbalb, the fact that Berbatov and Modric both wanted out, and were possibly over valued, is irrelevant and matterless. The point is that once they were sold, they haven't, and apparently won't, be replaced, the same goes for VDV. We sign the likes of Dempsey and Sigurdson and Dembele and kid ourselves we have replaced them adequately, fine for the believers and the apologists, but obviously from a football point of view, not true.

Frank

right guys I've calmed down since the end of the game and have also read nearly all the comments on here - this is what I think. Firstly, whoever AVB put out today should have been good enough to win the game. Barring Naughton this was a team of full internationals. Secondly, and as has been pointed out ad infinitum, we are in desperate need of a striker and Dempsey is not that man. I can see the argument in his goal scoring record, but he is an attacking midfeilder. Lampard and Gerrard have great goalscoring records, but you wouldn't play them up front. I wouldn't have played Friedel; I can see no reason for resting a goalkeeper and I think it may have been partly to blame for a shoddy defensive display. Next, there were lots of voices on here calling for Walker to be rested, hey-ho this was the perfect game. We also have a left-back in need of game time to come back into the Premier League set up - again this was the perfect opportunity. I think it can be seen that Caulker and Vertonghen is not a pairing, and for one very simple reason. I love Vertonghen, but he very much looks after his own game. That's not a fault, almost that he expects you to do your job as well. Dawson and Gallas can talk someone like Caulker through a game, wheras Vertonghen can't. Next is my most controversial point, Mousa Dembele. I just don't get the hype. From what I have seen he doesn't create and he doesn't score - so I'm not quite sure what he does? Huddlestone is truly terrible - a lower league Premier league player at best, but on today's performance probably Championship level. His passing was always able to dig out a performance, but that has been off in last few games so you are left with a hefty lump of nothing in the middle of the pitch. Lennon is our one shining light, but when you have nothing to aim at, and no-one to slip the ball to, what are you going to do? The same can be said for Bale, whose performances have dipped, but he always plays better when Adebayor is up top so at least he has someone to aim at. Dempsey is trying his best in an unnatural role. For me, there is a chance that we can bring in Diame, Holtby and Hooper for £12 million combined. This is a no-brainer. And for any of you snobs out there who think they are no good (comparisons with O'Hara are a joke...) think of what a difference they would have made today. Holtby and a striker are essentail, but I think today showed up more than ever how important another midfielder is.

Sebthespur

Arsenal are not going to win the CL are they. They are as poor a team this year as i can remember, our goal ratio might not be as good as there's, but we have the look of a more consistent team. They will be punished for not spending, sooner rather than later. Of course we can finish above them. As i said, i think we need some new blood this window though to be almost sure. Everton just don't have the quality to keep up. So what if they have been slow starters and strong finishers in the past.

asherthesmasher

Frank, the value of the club is all well and good but that does not mean that our revenues have increased anywhere near where our salaries have risen. 145, 133, 146, 181, 178. Those are our revenues in Euros over the past 5 seasons. THose number do not show anything near what we have increased on revenues and we have not been making a profit on transfers as has been shown time and again. I'd love us to spend more. Glad we don't though. How much longer before Leeds gets back to where they were? COYS

peterballb

Who cares about trophies, leagues and Europe? Hell we're financially sound and well run. We've got a strong balance sheet. Do we get any trophies for that? Feck off we do. Unfortunately the only title ENIC, Levy and Lewis are interested in are those awarded by Accountancy Age. FOENIC!

SpuriousLife

Peter, I think what Frank is trying to say is that the money from Berba, Modric and VDV, wasn't invested in similar quality. I agree, all wanted out, although it is less clear with VDV. We sold Crouch when it was clear that he didn't want to leave, and replaced him with Ade on loan. Hardly long term thinking. I agree with CTS's Moutinho point. We allegedly were in for him for the tune of 23 M this summer, but now that money isn't available. Where did it go? It's a mystery. About two seasons ago during the Jan TF window we allegedly bid 30+M for Aguero, Rossi and other Spansih strikers. We didn't get anyone, and that money also vanished. Another mysery. What is clear is that we badly need a striker of quality by Thursday or this club will go no further than 5th-6th in the league. Defoe, Dempsey, a disinterested Ade will not cut it at all. I don't really blame AVB for what happened today, our squad is thin on quality, he is trying to manage what assets he has so that he can keep us going until the end of the season. I wouldn't play Friedel again unless I really had to, and I would pick a CD partnership and stick with it, but others need to be rotated. Problem is, the replacements are no where near as good as the first 11 picks, particularly in the case of Dembele, Parker and Bale.

Cleveland ARTSPURS

Frank You were doing well until them ....

How the phuck do you replace berbatov ,Modric ,Carrick etc .The reason why they`re worth so much is because they`re a rare specimen .

BUT we sell a player for £ 30 million & we then find the same player for £ 10 million ....

Why didn`t Man Utd ,Barcelona ,Bayern Munich ,PSG & Real Madrid etc think of that ?

big cockeral

No FRank, those players have not been directly replaced. But then we have invested to make the weaker links of the squad better. People moaning about this player and that. Look what Jol had to select off the bench. Actually, don't bother. Look at our starting MF and you'll see where money has been spent. Malbranque, Hudd as a starter with Jenas. Or better yet, Lee, Staltieri, Rocha. These were our starters just 7 or so years ago. Guess what, most would not even make our subs bench. Spend 80M on a striker. Don't know that that would have made our superior players show up today. COYS

peterballb

Spurious - I'm all for rotation but this was wholesale carnage of a team that dominated MU last week. He may have had no choice leaving out JD if was injured but leaving out Walker, Dembele, Lloris and Dawson, with Parker, BAE and Verts all on a comeback from injury/illness was downright stupid. We did not lose this match because of Levy or Lewis.

Love totty

Shedboy, depends what level of "technical" you think is good enough. He went to Wolves, that's how technically gifted he was. Holtby is a key player in a Schalke 04 team. That tells the story. It's not technical ability we should be talking about. If Holtby had O'hara's physicality we wouldn't even need to discuss how Holtby may or may not get on in the PL.

asherthesmasher

POINT ONE;from the squad pick the side to do the job and progress, this is a possible banana skin of a game, Lloris; Naughton; Dawson; Vertonghen (if fit) BAE; Lennon; Parker; Dembele; Bale; Dempsey; Defoe and we will progress into the next round, yes we have Norwich midweek, so get the job done and make changes, not the benitez way chasing the game and it's all to late, if anyone gets injured go and spend some money Read more: http://www.spurs.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=7514390#ixzz2JCLrbdoX POINT TWO; oh well let's hope we get this game put to bed early, some how i think we will lose or draw can't see us winning, that's some bench we have full of goalscorers. I can see the after match post's ''we need a striker'' Read more: http://www.spurs.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=7514390#ixzz2JCMOhYFl Nothing to do with hindsight, Jenas your contract is up in june we have found your replacement aka Siggy straw dust

spu 4 life

asher.... did any of us have Chelsea down to beat both Barca over two legs and Bayern at home in the final? Of course not, so to state that Arsenal won't win it is pretty foolish considering the way we got burned only last year. Prepare for the worst and hope for the best is a far better approach, unfortunately that'll cost dough and ENIC don't consider THFC worth investing in

thfc1882whl

Absolutely pathetic from Spurs! No excuses, Leeds deserved to win the tie! I am absolutely fecking sick and tired of Levy. Great with the finances but a dunce particularly in the January transfer window. The team needs a good striker and creative midfielder YTWO WEEKS AGO but fu*king tightwad Levy will bring in two broken down offcasts as he did with Neilsen and Saha last year. AVB has done a great job, particualrly with the injuries we've had but he's being hamstrung by Levy! If there are no big signings this January then failure to get a CL spot this year rests squarely with Levy!

canadianraptor

We lst tjhat game due to our back line, BAE was brutal, Verts and caulker were awful together. Then we went two up top and didn't get the ball wide once!

Slurms McKenzie

didnt we replace carrick with modders? could you not argue VDV was a replacement for Berbatov? seems like some people have distorted memories here.

tophobunty

Where`s V.D.V now ? Where`s Modric now ? sense the pattern

big cockeral

i dont no what all the hype is around bale he wasnt much better then there rest, and BAE is loose cannon

123spurs

Right the cup is out of the way now focus on the league and europe. I'll settle for third and the Europa league this season but thats it. Next year AVB will have to start to deliver!

Slurms McKenzie

HAHAHA........stupid SPUDS, smack on your Chicken face........lost to Leeds, lol !

the_blue_world

Bale would have been man of the match ifw'da striker t ctualy conert his crosses! Hardly Bales fault he's not n chare of transfers!

Slurms McKenzie

If Defoe is injured what the feck are we going to do? Do we even have scouts at Spurs? It'll be Siggy and Dempsey again against Norwich.

Fanman

peterballb- please show me how much our wage structure has gone up?...the individual salaries of some players could go from 45k to 100k and not affect it....I'm sure you understand the difference although I'm sure others on here wouldn't have a clue.

shedboy2

Yup the_blue_world well spotted. We're out of the cup so no fixture conjestion to worry about we can now concentrate on Third!

Slurms McKenzie

@Total knobhead-- Hey *****er looked happy when Brentford scored, how is your Spurscum doing now??? Fecking (unt, now feck off to ur little scumy chicken lane.............

the_blue_world

The pitch was shocking but our back line were worse Friedel should have saved the second!

Slurms McKenzie

Siggy huffs and puffs, but he doesn't blow any houses down.

Fanman

slurms best cross of the day today was from lennon for dempsey to miss a sitter. i dont actually remember many very good Bale crosses today, most likey because he spent too much time on the right and or roaming, if he is told to do that i think it is a tactical mistake.

tophobunty

I disagree Fanman I think siggy blows!

Slurms McKenzie

Fanman - the rumour I've heard is that Defoe will be out for at least a fortnight. It will be Siggy and Dempsey against Norwich.

SpuriousLife

the_blue_world, ****head. Go blow another 50 million on a fecking flop. Roman won't be around forever toolio.

Fanman

Someone had to offer something in the middle that seemed to be Bal'es role with BAE expected to bomb up the left wing - worked a treat!

Slurms McKenzie

Slurms McKenzie, he sucks too!

Fanman

i assume this blue world guy supports chelsea. this to me shows the sad side of football. so many supporters with such limited intelligence. it would just be great if we could remove such pond life from the great game and then supporters of other sports wouldnt think all football supporters failed the 11plus.

tophobunty

Apparently there is an article in the Sunday Times which says that DL is refusing to pay over 10M for any player this window and that Spurs will sell Gareth Bale in the summer to fund any further TF activity. Not good news. Is the Times still a respected newspaper, or could this be more BS?

Cleveland ARTSPURS

SpuriousLife, Noooooooooooooooooooo! At the beginning of this thread I actually suggested Siggy and Dempsey instead of Defoe... Right now to have Defoe would seem like a God send. Even Ade would be like having a new signing after that dross.

Fanman

so peter looking at your wage figures we can afford to pay another 10m on player salaries and still be within our structure (70% of t/o)....Also salary rises are also part of levy's control so if they are too high and damaging further investment whos' fault is that....?

shedboy2

modric is on bench voted worstplayer in spain and vdv is midtable look where we are with outthem alot of player changes and still top 4

123spurs

At least Liverpoo is out, too.

Total knobhead

"@Total knobhead-- Hey *****er looked happy when Brentford scored, how is your Spurscum doing now??? Fecking (unt, now feck off to ur little scumy chicken lane.............," the_blue_world.

Looks like I succeeded in getting under someone's skin from Chelscum. Almost makes my day. Not quite, but it's in the right direction.

Total knobhead

THFC in the FA CUP during the Levy/ENIC era. The history... Entered the tournament on 13 occasions. Won the competition 0 times. Have failed to reach the final on 13 occasions on the spin...

pelebro

when will people realise that we are not able to outspend united, chelsea, arsenal, city and liverpool. it is impossible. we are not one of the bigger teams, this is not a lack of ambition it is reality. we have to try and find the next modric, berbatov etc, we cannot replace them with similar quality because they were exceptional. our model has to be to allow them to leave once they really make it clear they want out, just be glad that we have a chairman who makes sure that whoever poaches our best players have to pay an arm and a leg to get them. as to not reinvesting, firstly we have increased our wages considerably to ensure that we can keep our best players for as long as possible, and we certainly will spend on the right players, its just not that easy when you are never going to be first choice for the players who would really improve us

Guernman

And to think before Sugar turned up, a season after we last won the worlds most famous domestic cup comp in 1991, we were known as arguably the greatest FA Cup side of all times... 22 seasons on, Sugar and his pathetic fantasy football apprentice Daniel Levy have failed to reach the final on a single occasion... Your taught your Fantasy Football apprentice brilliantly Sir Sugar!

pelebro

Cleveland. The Times is still respected. The story is probably true. Sad but true.

SpuriousLife

asherthesmasher- the level of tech ability I was referring to was the ability to join a team in top 4 and help us maintain or kick on....It's too much to ask of an U21 player....

shedboy2

slurms concentrate on europa and league today proved if dembele, parker now in for sandro and defoe get injured are back up is NIL, We are going down shi7 creek, not aimed at you, just the observation on today

spu 4 life

I tried to ignore Frank's comments for the longest time. Your pretty much in the same league as Frank Shedboy. Either your passion for Spurs deludes your brain(not so bad), or you are just naturally illogical. I don't spend much time on here because too many of those type are emerging. Although i would rather that type than the BigC type, who is just about as big a knob-end as they get. Until next time, cheers, UTS!.

asherthesmasher

@Spuriouslife: Bad news indeed

Cleveland ARTSPURS

Guernman - I don't want to fall out but please stop talking like an accountant and start thinking like a fan of an apparently ambitious football club.

SpuriousLife

Last season we rightly lambasted Redknapp for wearing out our first eleven by not rotating, we are now having a go at AVB for doing exactly that. We have an away game midweek so he had to balance the two, unfortunately we lack squad depth, look at the Man U game, we had our best eleven on the pitch but absolutely nothing on the bench. Levy knows this but will he do anything about it? I want to live for a few more years so I won't hold my breath. COYS.

ItalianYiddo

Guernman

When are you going to learn that SPURS are in the top 5 of all time EPL spenders .

big cockeral

One last thing Shed, sorry, i agree with that one. Don't think Holtby is necessarily the answer this window. I think you may be one with which your passion for Spurs effects logical thinking:).

asherthesmasher

Guernman- no we don't have the spending power of the super clubs or apparently the ability to have a transfer budget....but we have 450m loose change to pump into a stadium....it's all about priorities and getting the balance right...imo the balance is out of kilter at the moment. But all we be right in 15 years after we pay off the stadium that propels us to newcastle level....we could never compete with Leeds our stadium is not as big as theirs!!

shedboy2

tophobunty don't be silly, he thought the 11plus was a bus

spu 4 life

A year a go on this very site, many of the Enic Hotspur, Danny Boy Levy fan club members were telling us, that we are just 1 top level coach away from being a title winning side... A year on we are out of both domestic cup competitions by January, and are currently trailing the Premiership leaders by 15 points... What happened kiss arse Levy Enic fans??? Who's your next scape goat going to be Enic bum bandits???

pelebro

I still think that we will bring in a striker this window, I don't doubt that levy will spend as he always does, but to suggest that we have failed because we have not replaced modric and berbatov like for like is unrealistic, berbatov remains uniteds largest investment to this day, while modric was an absolutely fantastic player. we need to be finding younger talent who can become as successful, we cannot just go out and buy falcao and silver, thats the reality. I will be very *****ed off if we don't bring in a striker, but I do accept that we have limited financial means as opposed to other teams around us.

Guernman

ENIC OUT!!!

pelebro

away to city if we had won

123spurs

Levy really needs to pull the rabbit out of the hat now .
Today was pants ,but AVB has to take some of the blame with this Bale & Lennon switching wings bollox .

Levy & AVB need a long chat about how to fix things up

big cockeral

Pele, for the lords sake at least stop snorting that white powder at the weekends, your Mrs Frunk will be home soon to cook your dinner, she has just been on a tour of The Emirates Stadium.

tophobunty

I don't think levy an AVB need to have a long convo about how to fix things because things aren't that bad. We need Holtby in now and some sort of striker. I'd take Hooper. If we fail to get these two then for all of Levi's good work financially, it won't mean diddly squat because they will be the reasons if we fail to get fourth. People blaming AVB. But look at the team he was forced to play. Siggy in behind Demps wih Obika the only striker...an ppl blame AVB...for the defence. Thedefence we had today is a very good defence who have had very good seasons. Sloppy mistakes were what cost us the goals. Mistakes that opulent usuallyhappen. People who say rotation in defence doesn't work. I say before today we had conceded only two in our last six games I heard. With a rotating defence...

BrooksySpurs

Peelbro, do we have a top level coach now? have you just taken some up the left nostril as well, who is claiming AVB is top level? in the prem? if you can point me to someone on here saying exactly what you claim that would be good.

tophobunty

Peterbalb, you do throw some strange figures about, where did £80M for a striker come from, it would be almost a world record. During the period we have needed/wanted a striker, there is a list of players that have changed hands, many at budget prices, we have missed all of them. Try Steve Fletcher, Demba Ba, Jelovic, Shane Long, Benteki, Michu, Sturridge, Hernandez (Man U), and of course the classic Louis Suarez. All of these are better than what we currently have, and Suarez apart, none of them cost £20M. This was all while we were lying to fans alleging that £30M bids were made for the likes of Aguero, Rossi, Dzecho. As well as being incompetent, Levy is also an habitual liar.

Frank

BIGC with you on that they really do need their heads firmly together because we need 2-3 very good players by the end of this window to have a decent chance of 4th.

tophobunty

Clearly this result doesn't change anything as in the summer, avb wanted a playmaker like moutinho (we did not need today to know hudd is not top 4 class) and pace / goals - he wanted Willian. Still need those two as when dembele not there, we are awful. I know there is angst on here, but If we are not going to invest and Madrid want bale next year, maybe a loan back of modric. He regains some form, we do not let our season deteriorate again etc etc. a win at Norwich is very important. Avb put out a team strong enough to win and resting enough for Wednesday, but was badly let down by a lack of professionalism today. Sad, but come on guys, keep some faith, still a few days to go and holtby hopefully close.

Windlespur

Just seen draw, would have been a nice tie away at man city. Anyway, we can now go for the Europa league and PL double :)

Windlespur

Frunk you dont half bandy some strange names around that you claim to be better than Defoe and Ade...yes we need to improve, yes we nned another forward, WELL ALL AGREE ON THAT and yes we all would have signed Suarez BUT REDKNAPP turned him down...

tophobunty

Have just watched AVB's after match interview, an I am now certain we really are in big trouble. He actually said that he didn't expect us to sign a striker in this window. He said it ha been decided that we were happy with the options up front with Adebayor to return from Africa, and Defoe (who he admitted was injured), and Dempsey we were OK, an the risk was worth taking. It appears he is equally dillusional and ill as our chairman. He is either the original "yes man" or if he seriously believes what he has said perhaps one should worry re. his mental health.

Frank

I am well aware of the situation re Suarez or at least the alleged situation. Regarding other strikers, the 2 "strikers we have have up to press scored 17 goals in 48 games between them. You would be har pressed to find 2 less effective strikers than that, rather than scoffing at those with less exotic names than those that we look at, yes look at, never buy. Tophobunty you mustn't believe every word that our little slap headed chairperson says my boy already.

Frank

Hard to believe watching today that we took four of six points from Manure this season.

Total knobhead

Blame caulker Naughton and obika all you like, but at the end of the day those games against them type of teams is where you need your experience to be top notch, thudd, vertonghen, BAE let us down massively today, I'm really disappointed with verts today, hope he improves COYS

tottingham10

asherthesmasher- I thought I was being logical?? on which point did it fail me??

shedboy2

Why does AVB think that a club of Spurs stature is okay with only one striker in the squad?

MrSpurs

Frunk give me the stats of all the other striking partnerships this year minutes on pitch please, then you can have a balanced discussion on this subject. On another note how did you feel when your manager Wenger gave his post match interview when your club was knocked out of the Carling Cup away to Bradford?

tophobunty

If we fail to sign a

shedboy2

(This site jumps around too much)....quality player this window you have to assume the moutinho deal was a lie...pure and simple ENIC are feeding us bollox...we'll see if AVB sticks around but the omens are not good...ever since Levy got involved with the Politicians he's failed to deliver for the club on the pitch....but then again he will want the fans to turn against him at some point so he can say....'we've taken it as far as we can so in the best interests of the club blah blah blah we need to sell to (insert name of opportunist/business shark/benefactor) at a huge profit'...I just thought we were a few years away from that....

shedboy2

I was thinking which other club has strikers whose ability is in inverse proportion to the wingers supplying them with crosses, through balls etc? I'd say we're No 1 on that chart. Oh, and topho, don't try to argue from authority, unless you have it.

lordjohnny

one loss and verts is awful, avb is a gutless yes man and our board make ken baites and that chinese guy who owns birmingham look amazing, get a grip some of you, it was one loss against a decent championship team at home, these things happen its the beauty of the fa cup, we tore them to shreds for most of the game. weve played and defended better but its far from the end of the world

spurticus87

BrooksySpurs- It was the first time I've seen AVB play Caulker at RCB and he's been out of the team, Naughton hasn't played many mins at RB, Verts was back from illness, BAE back from injury and Brad back from the retirement home....AVB put them all together today. That said I'd have made the same mistake today....on paper they make a half decent defense.

shedboy2

spurticus87- Verts was awful today! I don't think anyone is saying any more than that. We need a striker, hardly kneejerk we've been saying it for years. Do you expect everyone to ignore what they saw today? Not to voice an opinion on a site built for that sole purpose...c'mon get a grip...;)

shedboy2

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/premier-league/9255617/Revealed-the-financial-health-of-the-Premier-League-laid-bare.html

http://www.scribd.com/doc/55741334/Sport-Scribd-Doc

http://soccerlens.com/england-football-money-league/102043/

the first two links show the salaries for the three most recent years available and the third link shows the revenues of the top clubs for the last 5 years. To the best of my knowledge, these are the accepted numbers and are taken from the Deloitte audits of PL teams. Revenue is already not keeping up with the wages. That said, it seems we are still managing to turn a small profit or suffer a small loss on a year by year basis. I have no problem with a huge net spend and a temporary net spend on wages. I have suggested Willian, Negredo, Son, but here is reality. Son, could be done if we'd stump the cash. Negredo will happen at the last as he will choose where he wants to go. That he will be offloaded, there is no doubt. It's the where that remains at issue. I presume it is down to the player and he will, no doubt, decide at the last. Willian, they do not need to sell, so we either stump over 20M (which I believe is far too much) or we wait and see if Shakhtar decide at the last to sell for less than they want. I'll also say I think it is ridiculous we didn't just bring in Holtby. Arguing over a couple of hundred thousand is insane. Reduce the sell on, pay more now and call it a day. Castaignos, Arnautovic et al. I have lots of suggestions. What I don't know is what it is that AVB wants.

I find it frustrating that so many said we'd be lucky to finish 6th and that it was going to take at least a year to clean up the bloated squad, and to hear all the moaning when we are 4th with only Gomes (who has interest), Bentley (who may wind up back at Blackburn) and Jenas who is injured remaining to be offloaded. So, if we finish 6th or higher and have those three offloaded, I can't help but think the year was a success. And if we get CL, having lost 3 of our best players, it will be a testament to the team that AVB is building along with his coaching ability. How Levy and ENIC cannot receive credit for that would be mind-boggling, what with all the "asset-stripping" that is going on. COYS

peterballb

shedboy, you are correct, Caulker is not a right-sided CB. He was as lost as Dawson or Kaboul looks on the left. King never liked playing on the right. I, for the life of me, do not understand why Dawson was not in there. COYS

peterballb

I think i will aim my criticism at AVB and Freund for this poor showing. How dare they sit on their arse ! for so long !! let's hope it is a one off and can be corrected wednesday.

82spursdebut

shedboy, you could also choose to just believe what was reported and that Moutinho, but for a third-party owner that wanted more, was all but done. Much easier to call it all a lie. Surely Levy just wanted to justify a vacation in Portugal. COYS

peterballb

Leeds won because a club in their position won't have been playing for money. They would have been playing for the passion and romance of the cup, for the Club traditions and for the pride of the club and themselves. No matter how technically gifted a mercenary is, at the end of the day, he is only playing for his wage. There is a HUGE difference. That is all I have to say on the subject. Good night and take care all. Work beckons in the morn.

chrishove123

FRank, re: Suarez, Redknapp was quoted as having stated that himself. Unlike Harry, Levy doesn't blab all over the place. Nor does AVB. So there really isn't much to go on. That said, AVB said Moutinho was not signed due to third party ownership. Liars, the lot of them. Or just reporting things as they occurred. COYS

peterballb

cleveland- the 35mil levy was promising was total bullsh**e he never had any intention of spending that sort of money, it was just a ruse to shut the fans up.another window about to close and again nothing going to happen.

topspur53

I'm glad we're out of it. We've got bigger fish to fry.

Henry Baker Brown

peter- I've not looked at the links, from memory our wage structure is roughly70% of t/o we posted c144m so we can spend up to about 100m on wages and still be within our structure- now if we want to pay 1 player 50m a year we can! It just means that all the others have to be paid out of the remaining 50m, I'm sure you understand that but I thought I'd spell it out for those who struggle with Math. Again Levy is in charge of salaries so IF they were too high it's his fault (whoever put Gylfi on that wage is a moron)....ENIC won't get credit for us going backward....football is a results business....last year we finished 4th. If we finish 5-7th but are playing well or moving in the right direction I'm sure people will not complain....but to go backwards with a wimper, without trying...that won't be tolerated. Levy could be the man who bankcrupts Spurs....with some fans clapping him all the way....450m gamble.

shedboy2

blessing in disguise?

laughter7

thfc1882whl, first off, Moneyball does work and has been used by many organizations to achieve success beyond their revenues and buying power. Second, Dempsey was not inexpensive and hardly fits under that term. In his last 12 appearances, he has 6 goals 4 assists in all competitions. Only once did he get a brace, so he got a goal or an assist in 9 of his last 12. That's pretty good for any player. Not the quickest. Not the best turner but he keeps trying. Hands on his head and giving up on plays? Not him. Look elsewhere. If Defoe tried as hard or had the same level of team ethos, he'd be looking at 20-25 goals per season. COYS

peterballb

peter- how can AVB be building a team, he has not bought one player.

topspur53

blessing in disguise !?..possibly. We will get a clearer picture after the Norwich game, perhaps.

82spursdebut

No fight no guts no creativity no urgency no decent striker no decent full backs. 23 years since we won the FA cup and it will be another 23 years til we win it unless we sort these problems out. By the way friedel was not to blame for this defeat, that was down to the fool backs, yes i did spell that right.

whitehartmart

Let us not be overly concerned about our defence. Today was a poor day at the office, especially from Caulker and Verts who have otherwise been excellent. Just one of those days, but I thought we had toughened up a bit, as FA cup always throws up such defeats against mentally weaker teams and I had hoped we had got much better. A one off? Lets hope so, but Wednesday is now a very important game for us. A draw away to qpr and at home to Man U were ok, but still only two points from six, so we need to start picking up three pointers again now. A top quality signing ( or a Holtby arrival) would be a good statement of intent, but should have happened already. An important week ahead on both points and transfer front.

Windlespur

peter- it's hard to believe we were prepared to break our transfer record, didn't spend any of the money allocated and now don't have a couple of pennies to rub together....it reeks of PR....and that would be worth a trip to Portugal alone and I suspect DL would have also seen if he could get them down to a packet of crisps and a pint of lager...

shedboy2

As much as i would love us to get in the champions league,i have no belief what so ever that we will finish top 4 with this squad of players that are available.Lets just hope AVB is lying and Levy is getting his cheque book out this week.Sigurdsson is just not good enough for spurs,Dempsey is ok but can not play as a striker,caulker and naughton are ok as squad players but should be no where near our starting line up,and for all you parker lovers out there i hope you have all realised that sandro will be hugely missed.All i can see is heartbreak again if we dont get a few in.what i would like to see...... ins-Diame as a cheap stop gap till sandro gets back next season i just dont think parker will be the answer holtby to battle dempsey to play behind the striker and fill would love to see us get willian but dont see it happening and please levy its about time you broke the bank for a top striker dont know who is within our reach tho probably just hooper

gsmith84

This team need to work in training on the last 25 yds of the pitch ! Also learn how to pass a ball forward.if these players have any dignity they will give there wages to chairty this week.they got it for nothing ,can always use the backhanders from leeds to pay the morgatge this mounth.being spurs frustraited is worse than sexual frustration.as i always score in the end not always the answer for spurs frustaition ! Will we ever get a strike???????????top 4 your having a laugh???????

Little spur

We wouldn't have got pass city so a game off on the 16th Feb could do us favours. Next month will make or break our season, Norwich, West Brom, Newcastle, Lloyn and West Ham are all very winnerable games. We need maximum points to set us up, it was about this time last year it went Pete tong.

T.H.F.Chris

Moneyball works in US sports....not sure it works so well in the beautiful game. Also everyone is at it meaning those that hit the 'stat of the moment' are more expensive negating the system....playing the percentages as a manager will get you Graham Taylor or his modern counterpart Sam Allardyce...

shedboy2

if we are No1 Lordjonny you must have considered all the others, to offer a balanced view of course. In this case would you kindly order the rest of the prem as you see it 2- 20 please.

tophobunty

We got in the top four and the CL without a proper striker a couple of years ago. We had 2M Peter pretending to be a striker.

Total knobhead

Gsmith - I and many on here rate Sandro highly and know that he will be a big miss. However, Parker is a great back up, but NOT when played next to Hudd. A little harsh blaming Parker who was fantastic last season and showed heart today. Hudd on the other hand should be sold and clearly was not an avb squad choice as was being sold, so just shows why we need a midfielder and striker now. As avb wanted in summer btw.

Windlespur

shedboy, we have brought in Vertonhen, Dembele, Dempsey, Lloris, Ade, Sigurdsson, Fryers, Holtby while also upping the wages of Walker, Lennon, Defoe and Bale. Modric wanted out. VDV wanted out. King had to retire. We made money on Modric (who was on paltry wages). We made money on VDV who was on good wages. I am on the record as saying I would spend the money now for the simple reason that wages will all even out (short term pain). Jenas, Bentley and Gomes are likely all gone. If we brought in Son, Negredo, Willian, Holtby and Belhanda, the net transfer cost of those 5 would be about 50M. Sell Gomes and Hudd (obvious sales) and the net loss is at about 45M for the year (not a good number BTW). On the more damaging salary front though, it is not so bad. Gomes and Hudd, that's probably two of the salaries taken care of. Gallas, Bentley and Jenas at year's end, probably takes care of the balance. So we are ok on the salary front. If BAE stays (the idea of taking big $ from Chelsea for him is tempting) Rose is certainly sellable. If Son, Willian and Negredo all look like they fit, Defoe could easily be sold, or Dempsey, or Ade. If Holtby and Belhanda settle then Parker, Sigurdsson, Livermore and others become sellable. I would spend the cash, but it really is the call of Lewis. If we can only post marginal losses to get the financing we need for the stadium, what do you do? Lewis, as he has shown, will not be buying us out of stupidity. For so long as he is the owner (no inkling he will sell until the stadium is bult) this is our reality. We can moan all we want.

Shedboy, I believe (numbers aren't out yet) we exceeded the 100M on salaries last season. This season will be worse. Where does that leave us? COYS

peterballb

Heung min son...scored today........i think we may have missed the boat there. H'm' son and Negredo...would be ideal, imo....but, alas, i cannot see it happening.

82spursdebut

Not having a recognised striker today was an embarrassment. We call ourselves a big club that is not the position a big club should ever find themselves in.

MrSpurs

2nd half season collapse???? surely we couldn't be that stupid again, could we????

shedboy2

Come on levy.......

Windlespur

Shedboy, just for fun, I'll disagree with you on the Moneyball thing. Why can it not translate if your LW is the one who delivers the most crosses in dangerous areas, with the best defensive back pressure and the most accurate passer? Modric was all Moneyball. It's not about goals and assists. It was about interceptions, completed forward passes, tackles won, number of times dispossessed. This is why RM stumped all that money for him. He is, despite his size, goals and assist totals, pace etc, one of the best deep lying midfielders in the game. It's all stats. Same with Carrick. Berbatov, on the other hand was all about the glory stats. The other stats would never have a team sign him. Much like Defoe. COYS

peterballb

shedboy, you keep talking about all that money under the mattress. It isn't there because we have spent 60M on transfers this season. Levy will break his transfer record, but it will not be to throw money at the problem a la Liverpool. 35M for him and West Ham can choose to keep him for 17M at season's end. That loss is greater than our largest transfer fee paid, because we are not stupid. COYS

peterballb

@windlespur i agree with you that parker was outstanding last season but only up till jan then he simply was running his self in to the ground like he does but could not keep up good performances for 90 mins and that was one of the reasons we let 3rd place go cos he went from being so good to basicallly not having a big effect on the game.For me the performances from sandro this season have been outstanding and i just dont think parker can have the same effect to our play anymore,dont get me wrong he gives his all but just aint on sandro's level,thats why i said of a get out clause of £3.5m i believe Diame would be a great signing to give us the energy we need but arsenal will probably get him anyway and our focus should be on a striker.

gsmith84

Peter - we should have another striker in the squad, Levy / AVB should have addressed this a long time ago.

MrSpurs

I thought you might Peter...;) if you're LW is delivering the most crosses might mean he's good, might mean he's picking the wrong option are they converted or not? was he as effective against all teams or just certain styles? where does his supply come from? Who's backing him up? how much of his play is directed by the coach? Has he got the character for the move? and at what level?...I'm sure there are wingers tearing up the reserves or different leagues around the world that would flop....once you get a yes to all of those you'll end up with an expensive player....And if Modric was all moneyball doesn't that prove it doesn't work? Real are not exactly reaping the rewards are they?? I just feel that an 11 a side fluid game is much harder than smaller team game broken down into set plays or quarters...baseball, cricket, grid iron perfect for moneyball....Basketball, Ice hockey ok....football just don't see it.

shedboy2

No topho, I can't be arsed. That isn't the point. I'm not interested in a table that nerds can debate. Of more import is if you can tell me one other club that has such disparity to dislodge us from our No. 1 position.

lordjohnny

Can you explain more clearly what your meaning is Lord? It was a trifle confusing, you have tried to make a claim one assumes based on some foundation. I am simply asking for you to substantiate that claim by illustrating the foundation for it. This is your claim, so it's your call.

tophobunty

Peter- I'm not talking about money under a mattress as I said before we both know it doesn't work like that.....Also you can't say that Levy is doing a good job if we have not got a transfer budget, can you?

shedboy2

If you didn't understand what I'm saying, why ask for a list of clubs 2-20?

lordjohnny

Peter- so where's the 450m for the new stadium? is that under a mattress? or is all of it to be paid out of the extra revenue 20k seats supplies on home games? no deposit required....??

shedboy2

gsmith84-spot on with Parker...not a fan of Diame though...

shedboy2

Nothing has changed. In the summer, avb wanted moutinho and Willian. So far and today, we simply find it very tough to break down teams who put men behind the ball (compounded today by an unusually poor defensive display). this is Especially true on days like today, without dembele, so we need alternate options and the two avb wanted in the summer would certainly have given that. Avb needs to be backed Danny.

Windlespur

Windlespur- bang on...it's so simple.

shedboy2

ok Lord great please supply the information now you have clarified I was thinking along the correct lines. This way you can show the substance of your claim. If you can't do this, then there is no substance and you would be wise to withdraw it. Unless of course you usually communicate in this way then sadly there is no help available to you.

tophobunty

Liverpool, same problem as us, 1 striker. They get another, early. The only reason Defoe wasn't about today was to shake the copper jar. Levy, back him. Where is the cash, are we going to end up with Saha at 0001hrs with stories that the 20 milion was nearly there.

RAF Yid

You're bullcrapping topho. Read my original post.

lordjohnny

tophobunty writes "Pele, for the lords sake at least stop snorting that white powder at the weekends, your Mrs Frunk will be home soon to cook your dinner, she has just been on a tour of The Emirates Stadium." According to Danny's boy's, tophobunty boy, you have had to be taking illegal drugs, to have sussed that Levy has the worst trophy per season of any THFC coach in over half century, has failed to reach the FA Cup final once in 13 seasons, and has failed to provide 35,000 loyal Spurs fans on his season ticket waiting list with seats for 13 years and counting... Time to get out of Danny's boy's arse tophobunty! Your tripping on miser scrooge gas...

pelebro

Not sure why people think we won't have our usual second half of season collapse.AVB has rotated less than Harry(strongest team in Europa League) and we have a weaker squad than last year. All this talk about balance sheets and profit and losses obscures the complete mis management that has led to our current sorry strike force. I really like AVB but with the current squad and lack of sensible investment, a top four finish is very very unlikely.

jonathan01

Lordy Lord...it appears we are 11th in the conversion of chances created table, which is NOT good but that doesnt put us 20th which is your claim (how slanderous). We ARE 18th in clear cut chances created BUT that points to a greater problem being in the chances created department (creative midfielder or wing players). Now that is substance Lord. Where did you dream up your slander in this case? Was it born out of your team losing today or the lack of transfer activity or some other frustration??

tophobunty

Give it another 1 or 2 rounds of the europa and we will out of that as well, then we can cement our place in 5th or 6th for the season, because that's how it's all going to end. Bale sold in the summer to balance up the books; Every happy apart from us lot. As i said weeks ago take every win as a bonus and don't beat yourself up over it, we will be the everton of london, nearly but not good enough to challenge the top boys, we just don't have the money, some say we do, but the reluctance to spend it ends in results like today.

spu 4 life

peel, you quote a number of stats, but ignore other possible stats/factors people argued against you last week, I being one of a number. You are being totally biased to back up your argument refusing to take of board other important factors, with this in mind I will opt out of this one now as it's a pointless discussion.

tophobunty

spot on johnathan,i mentioned this a while back,take a look at daily mail stats page and see our players have played more minutes than anybody this season and more importantly more than the last 2 seasons at this stage-the point is rotation is crucial but not in a one off cup tie because their are no second chance,it should be done over 38 epl games

ghulamville

Just got back from the game, very disappointed with the defence. Vertonghen was absolutley shocking today, he's a fabulous player but today he was all over the place, he made Ross McCormack look like Messi. Caulker the same, Luke Varney was beating him in the air time after time and hes a foot shorter. Unacceptable from both. Siggy and Thudd looked mediocre too for me. Huddlestones physical condition is also unacceptable. I dont know what it looked like on the telly but only Bale & Lennon looked any good today, although they drifted in and out of the game at times they were excellent and if we had lets say A BLOODY STRIKER on the pitch then we would have won. Dempsey & Obika?? Appauling forward line. Also Freidel looked his age on their second, the reflexes simply werent there. It was a great strike but Lloris would have saved it. He played well though but you can see why hes number 2 these days. Not happy & im usually not this critical but today was terrible especially in defence.

HuddersfieldYiddo

medical football science is saying for optimum performance a player i has to play no more than 30-32 90 minute season,its theirfore upto manager to decide where and when

ghulamville

It needs freshening up, it really does. Praying for a striker before Tuesday otherwise last season could repeat itself.

HuddersfieldYiddo

shedboy, the 450M for the stadium is to be funded. One can only presume that it requires the product on the pitch to be living within it's means. Lewis, will be taking money out of his pocket towards the stadium. He has stated so. No doubt there will be a naming rights deal too. What we won't be doing is raising the first 50M by selling players as Arsenal did. We brought in 60M and we spent 60M all while wages were increased. Pretty certain that Dembele, Dempsey, Lloris, Vertonghen, Sigurdsson are on wages on par with if not above King, VDV,, Modric, Corluka and Kranjcar. In that fact alone, our wages have gone up. WE also increased the wages of Lennon, Bale, Walker, Defoe. THat, as a matter of fact reflects increased wages. It strikes me that we are ahead of Liverpool in the stadium venture. It's not easy. Times require that budgets be met. I would suspect our Transfer Budget is dependent on how much goes out. It's all part of the same whole. We lost money last season, on the whole. We operate on a very thin line. There will be an extra 20M next season due to the TV deal and a potential 30M assuming CL. Spending anything beyond that, wages inclusive, would be highly irresponsible. COYS

peterballb

I think that today showed just how weak we are in terms of squad players. Still no wingers to bring in for Bale and Lennon off days, centre midfield still lacks creativity and the less said about the striker situation the better. I really do think that ENIC do not know how to move us on. I think for them getting to the champions league was a bad thing as it got the fans expectations up. Better players should be coming in on bigger wages. I think the have been blowing smoke up our butts since then with Moutinho recently, and the big striker bids a few seasons ago. We are at the stage that when we lose our best players we need to replace them with similar quality replacements. We simply have not done that. I think that we will start the slide down the table soon and ENIC have taken us as far as they can do. I still want to know who is responsible for player recruitment. Siggy is not good enough and never was going to be. Yes he had a good goal scoring record but I do not ever remember him ripping teams apart. Dempsey is just a round peg trying to be put in a square hole. I like him but still do not see a place for him in the first 11. Not good enough to link play in the way Rafa did. I also think AVB can not come straight out and dish the owners for lack of spending in the window. I hope he is bashing down Levy's door behind the scenes. Had enough of the last manager airing all on tv at every chance he got. Still think we should have had enough today to win the game today but if losing today helps us push on for a top 4 finish, I will take that. But with what we have now I can not see that happening.

nothappyharry

spu4life, why would we need Bale's sale to balance the books? Are we 55M in the hole? We are breaking even. If Bale goes, it's because he wants to go and Levy gets the price he expects. COYS

peterballb

HuddersfieldYiddo this was posted at half time, not by me, but it's the best one;i see old tommy hundred-stone is back to his pie 'n' mash diet, he looks well out of shape, u can see his belly under the jersey ffs! what the ***** is he doing on the pitch its a disgrace for a well paid prem footballer, we may aswell have ten men on the pitch his passing has been woeful since he came back also si he cant even offer that! lillywhites101 Read more: http://www.spurs.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=7514390#yoursay#ixzz2JDUz1Tfu Hudd can pass a ball with both feet, shame he can't phucking pass Burger King..

spu 4 life

So players should play competitively for no more than 48 hours per year. Brilliant. Double their salaries.

lordjohnny

Bale will get sold Peter, it's levy's way, he has no interest in winning trophies, we are the only ones who care about that, his got a top manager and his bag of tools is empty. Holby ''free'' or 1.5m now? Fryers peanuts, sell on value. Peter dont reply i gve up phucking worrying about it, tell someone who gives a phuck.

spu 4 life

peterballb's latest ENIC master plan! He wants the THFC board to sale Bale to raise 55 million quid to finance the team, rather than Lewis dipping into his triple billionaire pocket, because according to Peter "Bale does not help much defensively and his lack of backside pressure causes issues".. Yes Peterballb really wants to sale Bale just a few months after we lost both Modric and VDV, and then hand over the 55 million to loser Levy, (none of which will be seen by AVB) to play more Fantasy Football Ebay with... Peter, did you not notice that loser Levy has already spunked the sixty million he raised in the summer from his 'out going' Fantasy Football sales, and that what he has brought in has made the team weaker than last seasons? Same old ENIC logic... make the team weaker, to make it stronger... Same old 2 steps forward, 3 steps backwards, Daniel Loser Levy! ENIC OUT!!!

pelebro

I think we need to sign/loan 3 players, 2 midfielders and one forward. I think Holtby will happen Tuesday, that leaves 2 more. Will they happen?

tophobunty

Spu4 Bale being sold is NOT Levy's way it is a player who is borderline world class wanting to play on the biggest stage for the biggest clubs in the world, it's called ambition. Human nature, Levy can't stop this nobody can, what Levy can do is to allow us to capitalise on this as best we possbly can, 3-5 years out of a world class player for us coupled with 20-30 million profit is VERY real world. Like you I want us to improve, to spend more, but I want to stay in the real world.

tophobunty

pelebro, you haven't a clue what you are talking about. Vertonghen played terribly today, is miles better than a crocked King. Lloris is miles better than Cudicini or Gomes (take your pick). Dembele is certainly better than a player who is refusing to play. He's no Modric, but better than an on strike player. Dempsey is certainly better than Kranjcar. VDV has not exactly impressed (but for 1 week) for his current employers. Now, have we replaced Modric with another 36M player. No, and that's not going to happen. Holtby may well turn out to be better than VDV. He's certainly looking better than him in the same League, so, I'm not that fussed. He didn't want to stay and fight for a place anyway, so, another moot point. As for using 55M from Bale, if it gets us Negredo, Son, Willian, Dzagoev,, well let's just say, I'd hail him the cab. We are Bale dominant. One assist all season for the player we give the ball to more than anyone else. Ok he's scored almost as much as Defoe (more often if it's based on minutes played), but still. ManU sold Ronaldo. Who's complaining over there? COYS

peterballb

Again, I never said I'd sell Bale. I said if Bale wants to go, there is nothing that can be done to stop that. Levy will get his value for him and we'll reinvest those funds in players. No team holds on to all their stars. COYS

peterballb

peter-you're bringing wages into the equation again...our wages stay within structure ie less than 70% of t/o....yes we agreed that we broke just about even this year on the transfers but we made 27m profit last year....also our accounts only took a hit after deducting the profitable bit...what was the headline 29m operating profit averaged for the last 5 years? (again from memory)...so why is Lewis prepared to 'dip into his own pocket' for concrete but not for the building blocks of a football club, the players? the money if not spent on players is being spent on the stadium...

shedboy2

And pelebro, loser Levy has increased the value of Spurs from 243M to 564 M from 2007 to 2011. What a loser. And he's done all that having a balanced budget year in and year out. If only Bank of Scotland and Lehman Brothers had followed such "loser" planning, perhaps the economies of the world would not be so bad making it so much harder to fund 450M projects. Losers all around, except Spurs who have gone from mid-table to cusp of CL and ENIC who have gone from a quarter of a billion to over a half billion. COYS

peterballb

Not happy by being jettisoned from FA Cup so prematurely but, isn´t this what this Cup is about ?? Anyway, Spurs´ performance today highlighted some points everybody knows (need for a playmaker and a decent, prolific striker) but also showed some news: 1) Dempsey is not a striker; 2) Siggurdson either need to be sent on loan or sold in the summer 3) Caulker is still, imho, "too green" for Spurs 1st team. I´m not saying he is not good, but I would have played Dawson today; 4) Bale need to understand he might have to be the next "Cristiano Ronaldo" but currently he is not and he had another quiet match. If he keep playing at this level till May, I´d would sell him for the 1st crazy spanish club willing to pay 55 million pounds for him; 5) Rotation is good, but it has some limits if the manager wants it to work properly. Naughton and Caulker showed "zero" intimacy playing together as Dempsey and Siggs behind him; 6) I don´t understand why Spurs´ players seem to be contaminated by a "I wanna win this match alone" virus... Bale, Lennon, Parker, Dembele, all of them carriyng the ball for yards and yards when a quick pass would create a more dangerous goal scoring situation. I sincerely hope that AVB and DL have some aces kept really close to their chests for this final transfer window week cos we surely need some to finish 4th.

AlexSpur

peter- say we spent 90m on salaries, our net spend on transfers was zero....where did the other 54m go? the 27m from the year before?....simplistic I know and not how things are really structured but the premise is that we can afford a player or two...it would be irresponsible not to buy nay negligent not to buy.

shedboy2

shedboy, we lost money last year. Read the article again. When including all the other figures, salaries etc, we lost money.

Tottenham Hotspur posted a loss of £4.3m for last season mainly because they did not play in the Champions League, the Premier League club said yesterday. Revenue was £144m, a 12 percent decline from the record level of £163m posted in the previous period "primarily due to the absence of Champions League football".

I guess that means we need to decrease salaries by 12% assuming we were on your 70% target last season. We have not done that. In fact, this season we are spending more (Bale, Walker, Lennon, Defoe and all the new signings). The numbers aren't that hard to appreciate. I would love us to spend more. Just please tell me from which revenues you are planning on taking all of these funds. Then we have a plan. COYS

peterballb

Peter there that's want we want: balanced facts. I want us to buy more quality players, sell less quality players and have a 60k seater stadium. I want us to win every game but like you I want to remain firmly in the real world and the facts are that we have improved in league position and financially under Levy at the same time as the playing field became less equal because of new owners at Chelsea and Man City. All genuine real world facts.

tophobunty

But shedboy, 2 years ago we spent 91+M on salaries. Last year was even more. This year more still. Our revenues were down last year and will likely be similar this season. So where is the money to come from? I would go in to debt for the players I mention, but it is debt. Loss. However you want to look at it, it's not money under the mattress. COYS

peterballb

Long term we need a new stadium, short term we need to achieve CL football and really short term we need to buy a new striker.

MrSpurs

shedboy, you can't just dig in to the owner's pockets (he has before but it always balances out year over year) and stay in compliance with the FFPR. You can have a debt, but it must be balanced out in the following few years. This is the way real households do it. Debt isn't bad. It lets you afford a house you can't afford cash down and it allows you to buy a car you don't have the cash for.....so long as you can afford the payments to service the debt. Spurs have debt. We have added the training facility to it. We will be adding the stadium to it. All fine and dandy so long as we can keep making the payments. We can and will because we are properly run. COYS

peterballb

peter- not reading it again but from memory it said 'after' not 'incuding' the two are opposite....how many players did we sign how many did we sell? if the figure was the same then the salary is unsustainable if we lost more than we gained, you'll see that offsets the increase...either we have a sensible salary structure or we don't...which is it?

shedboy2

Alexspur such very good points

tophobunty

shedboy, pelebro, spu4life, Frank et al, I have no problem debating the numbers. It would be nice if you'd throw some numbers the other way that suggest there is all this excess money lying around. A nominal profit or loss every year is hardly convincing me that there is money around to be spent. I have given you the numbers that are published. It's not from Spurs. These are from the League figures as audited by Deloitte or as reflected in Forbes. I have provided the links. 145,133,146, 181, 178 M Euros are the amounts for the past 5 years. That's total revenue, in Euros. We can thus afford about 100M in salary. Since 2 years ago it was 91M and salaries have clearly gone up, I'll suggest we are pretty close to those numbers, which is the max we can, as you have said, afford. COYS

peterballb

Shedboy, you don't need to read it again. I quoted it for you above. Here it is again. Spurs have more "operations" than just the football club.

The Club can announce a profit from operations of £23m (2011: £38m) for the year ended 30 June 2012. Looking across the past five years this measure of cash generated from operations has averaged over £29m per annum. Total Club revenue for the year was £144m, 12% lower than the prior year (2011: £163m), which was primarily due to the absence of Champions League football. Revenues continued to increase on the commercial front with media revenues increasing 10% and Sponsorship and Corporate Hospitality also increasing 10%. Merchandising was 4% lower largely due to the lack of Champions League participation, but the focus on cost control ensured that operating costs were also lower, down 1% on the prior year. The Club made an operating loss after football trading of £1.6m (2011: Profit £1.4m) and a loss for the year after interest and tax of £4.3m (2011: Profit £0.7m). The Club continues to comply with UEFA Financial Fair Play criteria and supports its further integration into the Premier League.

Just please don't come back with the ol' well they're lying chestnut. COYS

peterballb

peter- as you have just articulated...we've spent the cash on the stadium. We're taking a punt 10 years too late that an extra 20k seats will somehow allow us to compete with who? Citeh, Arse, Chelsea, united, Newcastle....no they'll still have more cash than us so we're taking the punt for what? to hope one may slip up and we sneak a CL spot...we did it, we got into the CL and our 'great owners' left us high and dry for players why? they are property speculators building a stadium and it is a punt, the avg age of PL fan in the stadium is now 41!!! In 2025 what will it be? where are the young professionals that will be needed to pay the costed ticket prices?...If we're not competing at the top they'll be watching in a bar, at home or on a stream and maybe not even watching Spurs...the more successful you are on the pitch the more people will watch and want to be associated with you...legislation makes entertaining less attractive for corporations....this could all end very ugly for Spurs...ENIC will be OK...the two are not the same.

shedboy2

Just a quick thought on the Bale leaving in the summer debate as I'm sick to death of typing about our owners. Much as I'm sure you're all sick of reading the same thing from me.
peterballb is correct in as much as Bale will go because he wants to play for for a big club that wants to win the biggest trophies. Is it too simplistic of me to expect the custodians of THFC to also have ambitions that match those of the best players? Is it too much to ask that those same people take a chance and invest wisely on players better than the ones they have at present? There have been players traded during this window that would have improved us as both a squad and a team, yet we're now said to be looking at the clogger from Wet Spam. At £3.5 million its a deal, it's a steal, it's sale of the phucking century! Do me a favour.
I don't want make weights at the club I've supported for 40+ years. I want our custodians to realise that we ARE a big club already, it's the ambitions of those entrusted to run THFC that are smalltime. We desperately need someone that football players respect at our club and his job should be to sell THFC to prospective recruits. We have a history that many clubs would be glad to have and we have always had a style synonymous with playing the game as it should be played. Footballers crave adulation just as much as they crave the trappings hat come with their wealth. Let's be honest here, once you've got £10 million in the bank, you already own your own home and your family is sorted for life. How much more do you really need? Any world class player that signs a 5 year deal with us is made for life anyway, we aren't the paupers some would have us believe. We are a worldwide brand that is being marketed poorly. We have allowed our masters in the Tavistock group to advertise their products across Europe for peanuts, yes, Autonomy are part of the Tavistock group. Looked like a cool idea, having different sponsor for Europa league games didn't it?
The long and the short of it is, if we had football people fronting the football side of things then maybe, just maybe, we could attract the players capable of taking us that next step forward and it really isn't a massive leap we need to make. Just a calculated risk is all, after all, To Dare is to Do. COYS

thfc1882whl

Ooops, wrote about the owners again albeit a little indirectly, guess it all comes back to them in the end doesn't it!

thfc1882whl

peter - you insult me....I don't come back with they are lying....I come back with 'the Club made an operating loss after football trading of £1.6m' ...what's happened to the profits from operations? the 29m per year from the past 5? and of course those accounts didn't include Modric and VDV....Accounts will always show a little profit or a little loss I would be devasted if Levy showed us making a 50m profit....he'd be a crap accountant if it did...

shedboy2

shedboy, there is no way a 100M team (if we were even worth that back when ENIC took over) was going to be able to finance a 400M stadium. Surely you can see that. Arsenal sold players to generate the 55M they needed for immediate financing. This is what Levy is trying not to do and what people insist he not do, and yet he is going about it all wrong.

We lost. Players like BAE, Vertonghen, Parker, Hudd, Sigurdsson all looked awful while Naughton, Caulker were clearly not comfortable and Friedel was, well, Friedel. Bale created a few chances for himself, little else. Lennon looked good. Dempsey could have scored three or four. There is no forgiveness in a Cup competition. The boys were flat. Caulker on the right was a mistake. If we had been defensively strong as usual, we, at worst, take it back to WHL. We were poor defensively. THis requires no further analysis. We need a striker who fits in the wage structure and who AVB wants. I'm sure there are not many options that fit both of those parameters. COYS

peterballb

horrible rumours coming from defoes best mate is 8week lay out-this could be a nightmare,is harry kane still on our books?

ghulamville

thfc1882whl, you do realize that part of the equation is money. It's not just trophies etc. There are 4, perhaps 5 PL teams that would pay Bale 40-60k/week more than what we do, not to mention the big clubs in Italy and Spain and PSG and some Russian clubs. Now, Bale would perhaps be willing to play for about a half dozen of those teams. And why not? 3M more per year. I keep reading folks on here who say that the money would not matter to them, but I seriously doubt that. I can be honest and say that I'd do it for way less. The ambition of ENIC, Tavistock is to continue to grow the brand. Anyone who believes that titles etc and a new stadium does not do that, is not being honest. They just aren't willing to steal from Peter to pay Paul. Why people moan about a formula that has been in place for a decade and will be in place for so long as ENIC owns Spurs, is beyond me. COYS

peterballb

No insult intended. Operations includes more than football revenues/expenses. That's what it says and, going forward, those "other than football operations" will get larger (stores, condos etc that are all part of the future revenues - that will not count towards FFPR revenues). Football operations ran at a loss. That includes wages, transfers and all other "team" revenues and expenditures. COYS

peterballb

peter- a cup loss, it happens, mistakes were made by players and AVB....but I have a problem with people saying we are well run...if we are well run you don't have to take to the field without a recognised senior striker, you don't say our salaries are too high to buy anyone else, you have a transfer budget (money over and above what you gain by selling assets- we are not a cattle trading company) and if you are not going to buy players so you can fund a stadium...you come clean, don't pretend you want the CL, you don't treat your fans like plebs you can milk....

shedboy2

Should have also said, that I presume those other revenues are what is allowing the creditors to say that a 450M stadium is "serviceable" It still has not fixed the problem that is what we have available to us. We will have a further 20M in TV revenues next year (as will every other club - inflationary) and a potential 30M if we can get top 4 and qualify for the group stages. Otherwise, we have 20M more to spend on wages and net transfers to maintain the status quo, i.e. a nominal loss from football operations. COYS

peterballb

shedboy Barcelona take to the field every week without a recognised striker, how badly run are they? so whats your point?

tophobunty

shedboy, and what does the "transfer budget" come out of? Surely revenues. We on average have a nominal net transfer profit or loss and make a nominal net profit or loss as a football club. The "other revenues" are not from the team. I don't know that a 30M "transfer budget" for QPR is a very responsible thing. Ideally, transfers should fund themselves leaving the other revenues for wages, which are the largest portion of our expenses. If we have a net spend of 30M, that 30M must come out of our other expenditures, which is mostly wages. Thing is, when you spend big money on players you tend to have to pay those players money. I am saying Willian,Son, Negredo, Belhanda and Holtby now would result in a net 50M spend. That money would have to come from sales to be balanced out. Wages, as I have explained would likely balance themselves out by summer. Make no mistake though, it would all be reflected on the end report as a huge loss. The question is, would the loss be recouped or would we do like Leeds, West Ham and others have done with their gambles? COYS

peterballb

peterballb ... A lot of what you say makes sense but what I'm trying to say is we are ALREADY a big name 'brand' (jeez I hate the way we're a 'brand' now), it's up to those in charge to start acting like it. If I were a player who didn't support THFC, I can honestly say that I would be loathe to speak to Spurs because of the reputation of Levy. He is a massive negative, now neither of us know the truth about whether Modric and Berbatov were lied to by Levy regarding contracts, signings and releases but as a prospective employee I'd be right to be on my guard in any dealings with him. Mud sticks and regardless of the truth, he's a busted flush where reputation is concerned. That is why he needs to wind his ego in a bit and employ a football man who can sell us to players. I'm not calling for massive investment and you know that as we've been down this road before. To do nothing in this league is to go backwards. Far more important to a very rich player is the ambition of the club he's joining and players see us selling our best players once they reach their optimum value, why on earth would a world class player want to be here to see the team sold from around him?

thfc1882whl

Pelebro, how old are you 12 maybe 14. I don't normally like to single out posters but what foolish, childish remarks can one individual make. I understand the frustrations of posters like Frank, THFC1882, CPS, Shedboy2 and even Big C and whilst I don't agree with many of their comments and conspiracy theories, I don't see them belittling others who have differing opinions. Why do you feel the need to come on here and drop a load without offering a shred of intelligent discussion. Go home before your Dad comes to spank you.

jvd

thfc1882whl, I would hate to read one of your long thoughts !!

tophobunty

thfc1882whl, first off, we have increased the wages for four of our top players. We have also brought in 60M worth of talent and paid them accordingly on the wage front. That is not doing nothing. Does it replace, VDV, Modric, King, Carrick, Keane and Berbatov directly? King, Carrick, Keane, yes. The other 2 no, but we have, on the other hand, bettered IMO, positions 15-20 in the squad. So we are increasing the strength of the weakest link. Is there more work to be done? For sure. Everyone said it would take at least until this summer to deal with the bloated squad. I'd say we're on target there. Most on here said we'd be lucky to get 6th. Well, season is not done yet, but we are in 4th. As with the past 2 seasons, that can mean nothing.

As to Levy's reputation with respect of Berbatov and Modric. Both refused to honour their contracts. That's what they promised to do. Did Levy stop paying them because they wanted out? NO. Did Levy throw sling their names in the mud? NO. The players did Levy though. Modric specifically, I could care less what was said after Modric met with Roman Abramovich on his yacht. I could also care less what happened regarding Carrick, Keane and Berbatov after they were tapped up. REally it matters not at all to me. Levy, whether I like it or not, needs to squeeze every possible farthing out of every deal as it will be one more farthing we have to invest on players. Sucks, but that's our lot. The only issues that have, IMO, caused issues with players wanting to come to us is that we do not have CL and we do not pay top dollar. The second is our lot. We must get on with it. The first requires us to do things better than the other 5 clubs that have far greater resources than we do. Make no mistake, adding the extra seats will only make us on par with Arsenal. It will not change what City, Chelsea, UNited and Liverpool will spend. We will still have to do it better. More harm was caused to our name by Harry bringing players in and not playing them. I almost spit my coffee out when I heard that Harry was interested in bringing Kranjcar to QPR. You can't make this stuff up. Despite such a "sullied" organization, it seems Vertonghen, Dembele, Dempsey, Sigurdsson, LLoris, Fryers, Holtby all signed on the dotted line. I have to think money was one factor, but surely Arsenal, Liverpool and a few others could have paid the same. They must see something in what is happening to make them sign. Levy makes very few comments. To suggest he acts out of ego is ridiculous. He, like Lewis act in their own best interests. The more Spurs are worth, the more they are worth. Cups, titles, CL, stadium and other projects all enhance that, so long as it continues to be well run. Other than the treatment of Jol and Ramos and stating that he would not sell Modric for any amount, I have very little I can take serious issue with. I would never have hired Harry, but I can see why ENIC did. I certainly can't begrudge him such decisions just because I don't like them. Objectively, I get it just as I objectively get why he does things the way he does. Last minute deals for key players is the only time we will get the deal to fit within our numbers. Sometimes it works (VDV) sometimes it doesn't (Moutinho). We could have done worse. At least our net transfers don't indicate owners that are pocketing the proceeds or spending irresponsibly. COYS

peterballb

could have done worse!, saha ffs no wonder so many good posters have left this site. get your head out of the sand. (or levy backside) cant read any more of this. no ambition goodbye

topspur53

Again, I am not against spending. I am just saying that any further "net spend" on players and wages needs to be costed over the next few years. There will be 20M more next season as a result of TV. If we get CL and get to the group stages, we can add another 30M. Whatever plan we have cannot assume and depend on those revenues. It must, at a worst case scenario, be affordable without destroying the squad. Leeds made that mistake and paid for it dearly from 2002. They still haven't recovered. Go to their Vital Leeds page. The constant message is about the stripping of the club which many believe is still going on. Birmingham did it. Pompey did it. Southampton did it and are doing it again. West Ham did it. Newcastle did it.. At all costs, Spurs need to not become part f that group. COYS

peterballb

Saha and Nelsen were Harry's choices. Any Levy transaction would have a sell on value. They were the best Levy and Harry could agree on. Not shocking there. Remy's wages are said to be ridiculous. That's what some want Levy to do. It'll never happen under his watch. I'll bet he's still ticked that someone convinced him Bentley was a good idea at that amount and on those wages. COYS

peterballb

Ambition = spending beyond your means. Got it. THe US are an ambitious lot. The Greeks, the Portuguese, the Spanish, heck, virtually all of the economies of the world. The total net spend of PL clubs this year on transfers alone is approaching 340M GBP or over 16M GBP per club. That does not include wages. No wonder 2 years ago 12 of 20 teams lost money. COYS

peterballb

peterballb..... Jeez, that's a lot to read when I've just woken up and damn you for being so rational ;-)
I guess the difference between us is that you take a statisticians viewpoint and look at things with emotion detached (not to say that you are any less of a supporter you understand), whereas I am coming more from an emotional side of the coin. Brains not awake enough to say much more at the minute mate, some would say it's never truly awake! I'm sure we'll go down the same old road again in the near future though. "Oh no!" I hear everyone sigh
tophobunty... Yeah I thought that too after my original ramble, sorry mate.

thfc1882whl

Ho Hum. Nothing changes.

Spuds-U-Like

Peterbalb writes, "pelebro, you haven't a clue what you are talking about. Vertonghen played terribly today, is miles better than a crocked King. Lloris is miles better than Cudicini or Gomes (take your pick). Dembele is certainly better than a player who is refusing to play. He's no Modric, but better than an on strike player. Dempsey is certainly better than Kranjcar. VDV has not exactly impressed (but for 1 week) for his current employers." Oh so you have tuned your old ENIC tune now Peter? Earlier in the season Peter was telling us all that Champions League Harry had a better team to work with than AVB, and should have won the League with last seasons team... Now Peter is telling us all his hero Levy has created a better squad this season, than last seasons? Make you mind up Peter. Are you now telling us that AVB (out of both domestic cups to lower league teams by January) is doing a worse job than Harry with a better team??? Are you now saying that Redknapp with a inferior team than AVB now has, made top 4 twice and finished in an official end of season qualifying position in 2 out of the 3 full seasons at the club with a worse team than AVB now has??? Make your mind up please Peter...

pelebro

Poor AVB this morning, who has not been backed by his Fantasy Football Joke of a chairman/DOF, must be starting to realize what a nightmare it is like (like the 7 coaches before him) working with the spoilt little rich kid brat who is playing with the THFC toy. I am sure AVB right now has his own ideas about which players he feels he wants to improve his team in these last hours of the window... But we all know, after watching loser Levy for the past 13 seasons, develop from kindergarten chairmanship under the watchful eyes of his mentor Sir Sugar, through the infants, the juniors and into chairmanship college, that when it comes to transfer window, Levy's coaches rarely get the player they want. Why? Because Danny Boy loser Levy truly believes he knows more about football than any of his 8 coaches and 3 DOF'S! But more importantly, the spoilt little brat, just loves to play with his THFC toys in those bargain basement bins... Real life Fantasy Football/Football manager Ebay January sales kids stuff... Time to take the THFC toy away for the spoilt child, before he does anymore damage to our great club! LEVY/ENIC OUT!!!

pelebro

Pelebro - AVB has been here for 5 minutes, give it a rest will you? We spent in summer and brought in at least 4 top class players in Lloris, Vertonghen and Demele and Adebayor. Add to that Dempsey, Sigurddson, Fryers and now Holtby. That isn't bad for a manager who has only been here for HALF A SEASON. How do you know levy won’t bring in another player before the window closes? What about further backing for AVB in summer? He clearly is being backed so far. Did you forget all those signings??? As soon as beenin backed I and many others will probably have the alarm bells ringing, but what you’re saying as of now just isn’t true. Yes we just had a poor poor game against leeds but did you stop to think for one second that it could have been the managers fault? A poor team selection or poor individual performances? We pretty much chucked the game and cup in my opinion. Come the EL i bet a stronger team is put out, which shows the priority are clear this season. The point is he HAS been backed, the other things like the training facility are here and the stadium is on the way. Calling him a spoiled child is a joke mate, I don’t get that. COYS.

SpursOne2

JVD, you write to me, "I don't see them belittling others who have differing opinions." JVD, I was merely responding to another poster who wrote "Pele, for the lords sake at least stop snorting that white powder at the weekends, your Mrs Frunk will be home soon to cook your dinner, she has just been on a tour of The Emirates Stadium tophobunty" You see, Frank, myself, and many other posters who don't believe the sign shines out of Levy's arse, repeatedly have to take the rude insults from the Enic Hotspur kiss arse crew... All mouth and no troucers, just like their hero Danny Boy!

pelebro

Here we go again. Boring!

Spuds-U-Like

Peter- yes transfer budget has to come from revenues....you're still to explain away how we lost the 54m? must be paying the stewards a little too much...I'd also like to know how Levy has made north of 25m?? There must be some cash floating around somewhere....again do we have a sensible wage policy or not? you can't say yes we do Levy's got it all under control and then...wow our salaries have gone up we can't afford anyone else.... tophobunty- OK just give us the recognised best player in the world and we'll use him as a striker....your point was?

shedboy2

LOL, what an incredible read all that was. From Enic out, to Levy out to the players out. incredible support lads well done all !!! NONE of us, not even our lord, Frank, know how to run a football club, none of us know the state of our finances, none of us know the primary plan of ENIC. Yet you all talk like you do know, and even better than that, you all know a better way. ............... spend money !!! Yeah, its easy isn't it, spend another £30m and we'll be alright, then after that, spend another £20m and we'll be all right and on and on it goes. We sometimes have to sell our stars yes, Frank thinks its lack of ambition and ENIC counting the money, the reality is that we are not the top dogs in this league or Europe. This is a shock to many of you I know, but in reality we aren't. This means our top players WILL be picked off by bigger clubs, just like we do to the clubs below us. This is how it is and will always be. So get used to it, pathetic moaning will get us no where. And if Franks prayers are answered and ENIC sell up, then what???? Who buys us??? A Russian billionaire?? probably not. An Indian chicken factory owner?? More likely. So then what do we do??? We are consistently in the top 6 of this league. Traditionally this is where we have always been, so why are you getting into such a frenzy now ??? This is as good as we have been for 20 years or more, yet you still just want more money. ENIC out, Levy out is an option. Here's another one ......... FANS OUT. Pathetic.

jimmy-yid

Deep breaths jimmy mate, let it wash over you.

Spuds-U-Like

jimmy-yid provides us with a deep insight into the mind of an Enic Hotspur fan when he writes, "And if Franks prayers are answered and ENIC sell up, then what???? Who buys us??? A Russian billionaire?? probably not. An Indian chicken factory owner?? More likely." Yes according to the fans of the present chairman and his triple billionaire scrooge boss, it would only get worse if the club was sold and a new chairman appointed. But when it comes to coaches and players, they are quite happy for loser Levy to hire and fire at will, sale the clubs star players and replace them with inferior ones time and time again... And it's fine for the present clubs owners to have failed to have provided 35,000 Spurs fans on the official THFC waiting list with seating for 13 years and counting... Perhaps if we had new owners they may take away seating and the grounds attendance would get smaller? And perhaps the new owners would fail to reach an FA Cup final in 13 years just like Levy? And only make the Champions League once in their first 13 seasons that they own the club, just like Levy? And perhaps the new owners would possibly have a worse trophy per season record that Levy has? (currently the worst of any chairman in over half a century). Better the devil you know, than the one you don't right Enic fans... I'm a Tottenham Hotspur fan! To Dare is to do! ENIC OUT!!!

pelebro

Who's your money on to equal Daniel Levy's 13 season THFC trophy haul... Little Swansea City, or tiny Bradford City???

pelebro

Please, pelebro can you give it a rest now? You hate Levy & ENIC. We get it.

Spuds-U-Like

Good post jimmy-yid. Grass isn't always greener, don't tell pelebro that though, he doesn't realise the difference between a fair division and financial-doping, poor lad.

Crissybwoy

There are many on here speculating, or, as I prefer to call it, pishing in the wind. Those who can confidently convert published accounting into possible calculations to finance a stadium are as far from the mark, as those who assert that a change in ownership will bring doom and gloom. The facts are that ENIC arrived in 2001, and they, no-one else, THEY, stipulated that capacity was their No 1 priority. Obviously so, as we are historically, worth far more than 36,000 in numbers attending home games. They have added 70 seats. 70. Seventy. SE...VEN...TEE. And, locked out at least 20,000 every home game. ENIC apologists can spin this any which way they like, but the cold hard facts from any business expert in any discipline is that you do not turn away business from willing purchasers, which is what they have done, and that is unforgiveable.

lordjohnny

Can't argue with that lj.

Spuds-U-Like

Spot on LJ

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